[RE-wrenches] Rack hardware, galling
frenergy
frenergy at psln.com
Mon Jun 29 16:50:07 PDT 2015
For about the last year, DPW has been sending all the 5/16" nuts which work with their mid and end clamps plus the foot-to-rail connection, splices, etc with a polymer coating on the threads. Since then I have had zero issues with galling or backing nuts off for fine tuning alignments. If your rack manu is not doing this job for you, maybe its time for a phone call.
Bill
Feather River Solar Electric
----- Original Message -----
From: Benn Kilburn
To: RE-wrenches
Sent: Monday, June 29, 2015 10:03 AM
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] SnapNrack
Good points Ray.
I always warn the crews of galling and to avoid spinning the SS hardware to fast. Another tip is to try to keep the SS hardware out of direct sun prior to using it.
Kinetic tells me that their threaded hardware comes with a clear coat of anti-seize.
Benn Kilburn
SkyFire Energy Inc.
780-906-7807
On Jun 28, 2015, at 3:27 PM, Ray Walters <ray at solarray.com> wrote:
Besides your note that cordless impact drivers can over torque the clamps, also they spin the bolts too fast which can lead to spalling of the SS hardware.
We now hand torque those connects. Finally, most torque specs are for lubricated bolts. We use anti-seize on the threads before torquing.
Using a cordless impact driver and no lube can cause not only module damage but also clamp damage, and end up with clamps not actually securing the modules, because the bolts spalled out before fully clamping.
R.Ray Walters
CTO, Solarray, Inc
Nabcep Certified PV Installer,
Licensed Master Electrician
Solar Design Engineer
303 505-8760On 6/28/2015 3:06 PM, Benn Kilburn wrote:
Chris,
It sounds (to me) that you are describing the bonding "tooth" dug through the aluminum frame and into the glass? or at least compressed the frame enough to break the glass? If that is the case then i'm betting that the clamp bolt was way over-torqued.
You need to check the recommended tightening torque for the module and for the racking system you are using. For example, what we are using these days, Kinetic, the tightening torque for mid and end clamps is 12 ft-lb and here are some recommended clamping torques from some different module mfgrs....
Conergy 8 NM - 6 ft-lb
Hanwha 5 NM - 3.7 ft-lb
JA Solar 18-24 NM - 13-18 ft-lb
These likely vary based on the construction of the module frame.
I've also found that some module mfgrs do not list recommended tightening torques in their install manuals, so best to use discretion.
We had a module break after clamping it down. The crew described it as 'putting the module in place, clamping it down and turning around to grab the next module and hearing a 'crack' followed by the crackling glass sound (if you have ever heard a module break, the crackling sound can last for a few minutes). The break pattern in the glass seemed to focus on a particular mid clamp. I used a torque wrench, set at around 10 ft-lb and checked all the mid-clamp bolts, increasing the torque setting by a few ft-lb each time until it finally turned a bolt instead of clicking. I found that most of the bolts were close to 30 ft-lb and the one that appeared to break the glass was about 34 ft-lb.
Suffice to say, we were getting carried away with tightening using cordless impact drivers.
At that point i and the rest of the crew started using the torque wrench as we were going along until we had a better feel for what was the proper torque. (i've done this before, but it is something that needs to be self "re-calibrated" often.
Benn Kilburn
CSA Certified Solar Photovoltaic Systems Electrician, SkyFire Energy Inc
6706 – 82 Ave NW | Edmonton, AB | T6B 0E7
P: 780-474-8992 | F: 888-405-5843 | www.skyfireenergy.com
On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 5:11 PM, Chris Worcester <chris at solarwindworks.com> wrote:
Hi Jason,
Have you or others been using the new UniRac SM mid and end clamps with the integrated bonding yet? My concern is the “Stainless steel Midclamp points, 2 per module, pierce module frame anodization to bond module to module through clamp.”
We had an MSI Alpha + self-bonding midclamp shatter the glass on an LG 280 last fall, as the factory set point was sticking out too far, so as it was being tightened down, on top of the module the point dug through the module’s top frame hitting the glass, shattering it.
I do wonder if there are any issues with this “point” on the UniRac midclamps potential for doing the same damage?
Chris Worcester
Solar Wind Works
NABCEP Certified PV Installer
Office 530-582-4503
Cell 530-448-9692
Fax 530-582-4603
www.solarwindworks.com
chris at solarwindworks.com
From: RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Jason Szumlanski
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 1:13 PM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] SnapNrack
That decision was based on our distribution network offering better pricing on Unirac, and engineers being comfortable with it. Now with the integrated grounding from Unirac, I can't see moving away from it again barring a significant cost benefit. It also stacks and stocks easier than the Ironridge rails.
On Wed, Jun 24, 2015 at 5:55 PM, Dana Brandt <dana at ecotechenergy.com> wrote:
Hi Jason,
We've used Unirac for years but have been contemplating Ironridge. I'm curious what your experience was and why you went back to Unirac?
Anyone else have input on best racking systems for flush-mounted residential systems on comp roof?
Thanks,
Dana
Dana Brandt
Ecotech Energy Systems, LLC
www.ecotechenergy.com
dana at ecotechenergy.com
360.318.7646
On Wed, Feb 5, 2014 at 12:09 PM, Jason Szumlanski <jason at fafcosolar.com> wrote:
By Snap N Rack, you mean Sun Run...
http://cleantechnica.com/2014/02/05/sunrun-acquires-rec-solars-residential-business-aee-solar-snapnrack-means/
I'm curious if these vertical integrators will still make their acquired brands available to small dealers through distribution. When SolarCity snatched up Zep, I had concerns about being able to service or add onto existing Zep systems we installed. That's definitely a concern going forward, and reason to perhaps stick with the most compatible racking solutions available. We used IronRidge for a while, which is largely compatible with Unirac, but now we're back on the Unirac bandwagon.
Interesting times...
Jason Szumlanski
Fafco Solar
On Wed, Feb 5, 2014 at 12:45 PM, Max Balchowsky <max at seesolar.com> wrote:
We have been using Snap N' Rack for a while, Have lots of installs in Hawaii - so far no problems, I like the convenience of the design for snapping in the slider nut in mid rail, and also the ability to install the panels flush with the end of the rails….
Max Balchowsky
Design Engineer
SEE Systems
1048 Irvine Ave Suite 217
Newport Beach, Ca. 92660
760-403-6810
"Building a Better Future For The Next Generation"
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Allen Frishman <amfrish at aeonsolar.com>
To: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>
Sent: Wednesday, February 5, 2014 6:17 AM
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] SnapNrack
I am curious about the mid clamps on the snapnrack. The flange that rests on top of the solar panel frame is so small ~ 3/16". Anyone experience any problems with these failing in a big storm? With solar panel frames not being square it is nice to have a little extra to grab - I am always curious as to why these clips are made with such a small area to hold the panels down.
All feedback on these clips is appreciated.
Al Frishman
AeonSolar
(917) 699-6641 - cell
(888) 460-2867
www.aeonsolar.com
On Jun 1, 2013, at 10:41 AM, Max Balchowsky wrote:
Have installed last three systems (35Kw)with snap n rack.
love it....
Max Balchowsky
Design Engineer
SEE Systems
1048 Irvine Ave Suite 217
Newport Beach, Ca. 92660
760-403-6810
"Building a Better Future For The Next Generation"
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Solarguy <ntrei at 1scom.net>
To: 'RE-wrenches' <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2013 10:11 PM
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] SnapNrack
The only complaint with the Snapnrack rails is the thin wall can easily be distorted. This will allow the nut to drop out of its groove. Love the universal end clamps but have learned to assemble every one to check for proper fit before getting on the roof.
Jim Duncan
-----Original Message-----
From: re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Drake
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2013 7:32 PM
To: re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
Subject: [RE-wrenches] SnapNrack
Hello Wrenches,
How would you rate the SnapNrack mounting systems against Unirac and other mounting systems?
Thanks,
Drake
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