[RE-wrenches] Fwd: Aqueous Hybrid Ion batteries

Larry Crutcher larry at starlightsolar.com
Tue Nov 11 15:28:05 PST 2014


The Aquion battery claims their 2.4kWh, 48 volt stack operates from 59 
to 30 volts. Many inverters have a LBCO of 1.75 Vpc (42 volts). 
Depending on voltage sag, that means about half of the capacity of the 
Aquion battery can't be used. Even if the outback can operate down to 
1.5 Vpc, you are still not able to use the full capacity of the battery 
unless your load is less than 800 Watts.

I have reviewed their technical presentation and it looks to me like the 
capacity simply can't be used in the off grid environment. If you can't 
use it, why do they rate it at 2.4kWh? BTW, the Voltage vs.Energy chart 
on the spec sheet does not match the first chart I posted.

It's great that the industry is looking at the requirements of future 
battery technologies. I'm anxiously waiting for any manufacturer that 
will provide better support for use and charging Li-ion batteries. I 
believe it is prime for off grid and mobile use and I, for one, am 
actively implementing that technology today.

Larry



On 11/11/14 12:00 PM, Phil Undercuffler wrote:
> Aquion has developed a pretty interesting product and they're 
> continuing to improve it -- I spoke with their engineers at SPI and 
> they've recently figured out some updates that give stiffer voltage 
> profile and therefore more effective energy. Energy density isn't 
> their forte, but temperature and cycling apparently are, not to 
> mention safety and nontoxic construction.  Not bad for a box of salt 
> water and carbon.  I also appreciate that they give detailed spec 
> sheets with multiple curves to help figure out performance at 
> different rates.  It is a battery that performs best when handled low 
> and slow.
>
> Aquion's spec sheets and manuals are available on their website, you 
> might need to register to get access but this link hopefully should 
> work. 
> http://info.aquionenergy.com/hs-fs/hub/147472/file-1917705156-pdf/1_Product_Documentation/AQ-SP-00018_A_Aquion_M100-L082_Product_Specification_Sheet.pdf
>
> While with any transformer-based inverter there are hard limits to the 
> voltage window due to the fixed ratio, the Radian GS8048A and GS4048A 
> have extended adjustment windows to better operate with new 
> technologies like this -- we allow you to run the DC voltage all the 
> way to the rails if you need to (Charge anywhere between 44-64VDC, 
> LBCO down to 36VDC).  When the voltage gets below 40-some-odd-volts 
> the waveform will definitely be flat-topping, but it will work.  As 
> new battery technologies come to market that have different 
> requirements than lead acid, you need more flexibility from the power 
> electronics.  We're just trying to give you more tools to work with.
>
> Hope this helps,
>
> Philip Undercuffler
>
> Director, Strategic Platforms
>
> OutBack Power Technologies
>
> 360.618.4306 <tel:360.618.4306> office  | 425.319.2821 
> <tel:425.319.2821> mobile
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Nov 10, 2014 at 11:29 AM, Larry Crutcher 
> <larry at starlightsolar.com <mailto:larry at starlightsolar.com>> wrote:
>
>     David,
>
>     Something does not add up to me. The cell has a voltage discharge
>     curve way outside of RE equipment, 1.75 Vpc down to 0.5Vpc. I
>     can't see how this technology could be scaled to RE applications
>     without wasting much of the capacity. From what I see, only about
>     40% could be used before LVD.
>
>
>
>     On 11/10/14 10:10 AM, Dave wrote:
>>
>>     Wrenches,
>>
>>     I have a customer with a grid-tied w battery back-up (formerly
>>     off-grid) with failing LA batteries. He found these batteries on
>>     the web and asked me to check them out.
>>
>>     Anyone out there know anything about this AHI technology and or
>>     this company, Aquion Energy?
>>     *http://www.aquionenergy.com/microgrid-energy-storage*
>>
>>     **
>>
>>     Thanks,
>>
>>     David Palumbo
>>
>>     Independent Power LLC
>>
>>     462 Solar Way Drive
>>
>>     Hyde Park, VT 05655
>>
>>     802-888-7194 <tel:802-888-7194>
>>
>
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