[RE-wrenches] NABCEP

Matt Lafferty gilligan06 at gmail.com
Fri Feb 13 12:39:26 PST 2009


Thanks Michael for bringing this up.

I vote YES. Allow the ED of NABCEP being allowed on the list, until and
unless NABCEP gets a dedicated Wrench-head employee that can speak to the
sort of issues we come up with here. No holds barred. Same basic rules as
Manus. No marketing, no bashing others, stick to your corner, protect
yourself at all times, only one rep on the list. Michael is the referee and
you must obey his commands at all times.

The learning will go both ways. I see it as "tech support" and "field
feedback" for our industry credential. This differs GREATLY from allowing a
building inspector or fire fighter or other government dude. I think we all
want that credential to mean something, have value, and continue to improve.
As NABCEP grows, more and more credentials are being added. What used to be
the original "PV Practitioner" is now "PV Installer". There are "new"
credentials now and coming up... Entry Level PV, Thermal, Wind... Pretty
much covers what RE-Wrenches is about.

In a perfect world, I'm in favor of questions or concerns about NABCEP being
sent directly to NABCEP and having them post the questions & answers on an
FAQ or info page. That's not gonna happen and most everybody wouldn't read
them all anyway. This effectively means that there is a failure to share the
information with 265 (or so) other Wrenches who just happen to have a stake
in it, too. Whether or not they are "certified".

How many questions have been sent directly to NABCEP by Wrenches that are
identical to the one somebody already asked? Or how many aren't asked that
should be? Will asking and responding onlist prevent duplication and
minimize needless concerns? I believe so. Will valid concerns be voiced and
responded too for the benefit of all? I expect they will be. Should we be
sending questions about "price" on the list? No. NABCEP needs to maintain
clarity and deal with that internally. 

I sincerely doubt that Rebecca or any future ED of NABCEP will spend a lot
of time monitoring the list and responding to stuff that doesn't apply
directly to NABCEP as an organization. Here, I'll prove it: Hey, Rebecca.
What do you think about 2008 NEC Article 230 and how it applies to PV
interconnections? (If she answers that one, I want to change my vote to NO)

We all know there have been many NABCEP conversations on this list over the
years. These have ranged from speculation to attaboys and complaints to
defense of the organization. In the past, some of the NABCEPers have been so
good as to forward Wrench conversations to the ED and have been allowed to
post the response. I believe that the responses have been helpful and
appropriate every time that I remember. Why should the 3rd party have to do
this? Why can't it be straight to the horse and straight back from the
horse's mouth?

Frankly, I don't believe that Ezra or the other board members should be
expected or required to answer on behalf of the organization or to forward a
conversation and wait for a reply. I sit on a tech committee with a couple
other Wrenches, and I ain't about to speak on behalf of the organization. 

NABCEP is of, to, by, and for Wrenches. Always has been. Let's keep it that
way.

$0.020001, 

Matt Lafferty
gilligan06 at gmail.com

-----Original Message-----
From: re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Michael
Welch
Sent: Friday, February 13, 2009 10:16 AM
To: re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
Subject: [RE-wrenches] NABCEP

Hello Wrenches. As always, please contact me off list about this subject if
you would like to weigh in. 

This is your list, and I run it by a consensus of your wishes. If any
changes are to be made, I have tried to at least come close to a consensus
among the Wrenches (not manufacturer reps) on the list. We now have a
proposed change in policy before us.

I am being placed under pressure by Ezra Auerbach to add an otherwise
nonqualified NABCEP staff person, Rebecca Eaton, to the Wrench list so she
may respond on behalf of NABCEP if Wrenches are discussing anything to do
with the org.

First, I often receive membership requests from nonqualified individuals.
Unless they are technically proficient, they are respectfully turned down,
and have included (among others): the general public, casual installers,
academics, trade organization staff, union staff, and now NABCEP staff. I
think you have clearly and appropriately drawn the line that we want pros on
this list in order to keep the discussion quality high. 

Second, the only exceptions to this have been "technically proficient"
representatives of the companies that manufacture the equipment that you
Wrenches install -- and some time ago, we reached consensus to allow any
fully NABCEP-certified individual, working pro or not. Ezra believes that
the manufacturers' privilege should be extended to the NABCEP staff person.

Third, I have offered Rebecca, and she accepted, the same thing I offer
other nonqualified individuals that might some time want to post to the
list: send your post to me, and I will post appropriate messages on their
behalf. I have done this several times over the years and in fact, did it
for Rebecca once already.

Fourth, there are at least 3 NABCEP board members on this list. While they
may not be prepared to respond with the nuts and bolts of NABCEP workings,
it seems to me to be good representation on the list. At a minimum, these
members could alert their staff, who could then respond through the
already-available mechanism mentioned above.

Until now, my efforts had been behind the scenes, but now it has come to a
head and I need to involve you because this morning I rejected a list post
from Ezra that was an end run around my off-list efforts. Here is that post:

>Hello Wrenches,
>
>I'm writing to you all wearing my "Chairperson of NABCEP" hat and wishing
to seek your collective guidance.
>
>The question is: Should the Executive Director of NABCEP be able to post to
this list on matters germain to the organization?
>
>Following the NABCEP Rant thread our ED tried to get posting access so she
could issue a timely and factual reply. She was turned down and as it stands
today she can not post relevant and informative replies.
>
>A very long time ago this list allowed designated representatives from
manufacturers on to this list so they could speak directly when appropriate
and we all have learned good stuff from the ensuing dialogue.
>
>It seems ulitmately silly to me that NABCEP Certification "qualifies" for
list posting access but being the ED of the organization does not.
>
>Please weigh in with your collective thoughts.
>
>Best regards,
>
>Ezra Auerbach





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