[RE-wrenches] NABCEP

Fri Feb 13 16:19:48 PST 2009

Hi Folks,

Please note that Michael asked us to give our vote offlist to him 
directly.  I will vote there.

Thanks!

Jeff C.

>Thanks Michael for bringing this up.
>
>I vote YES. Allow the ED of NABCEP being allowed on the list, until and
>unless NABCEP gets a dedicated Wrench-head employee that can speak to the
>sort of issues we come up with here. No holds barred. Same basic rules as
>Manus. No marketing, no bashing others, stick to your corner, protect
>yourself at all times, only one rep on the list. Michael is the referee and
>you must obey his commands at all times.
>
>The learning will go both ways. I see it as "tech support" and "field
>feedback" for our industry credential. This differs GREATLY from allowing a
>building inspector or fire fighter or other government dude. I think we all
>want that credential to mean something, have value, and continue to improve.
>As NABCEP grows, more and more credentials are being added. What used to be
>the original "PV Practitioner" is now "PV Installer". There are "new"
>credentials now and coming up... Entry Level PV, Thermal, Wind... Pretty
>much covers what RE-Wrenches is about.
>
>In a perfect world, I'm in favor of questions or concerns about NABCEP being
>sent directly to NABCEP and having them post the questions & answers on an
>FAQ or info page. That's not gonna happen and most everybody wouldn't read
>them all anyway. This effectively means that there is a failure to share the
>information with 265 (or so) other Wrenches who just happen to have a stake
>in it, too. Whether or not they are "certified".
>
>How many questions have been sent directly to NABCEP by Wrenches that are
>identical to the one somebody already asked? Or how many aren't asked that
>should be? Will asking and responding onlist prevent duplication and
>minimize needless concerns? I believe so. Will valid concerns be voiced and
>responded too for the benefit of all? I expect they will be. Should we be
>sending questions about "price" on the list? No. NABCEP needs to maintain
>clarity and deal with that internally.
>
>I sincerely doubt that Rebecca or any future ED of NABCEP will spend a lot
>of time monitoring the list and responding to stuff that doesn't apply
>directly to NABCEP as an organization. Here, I'll prove it: Hey, Rebecca.
>What do you think about 2008 NEC Article 230 and how it applies to PV
>interconnections? (If she answers that one, I want to change my vote to NO)
>
>We all know there have been many NABCEP conversations on this list over the
>years. These have ranged from speculation to attaboys and complaints to
>defense of the organization. In the past, some of the NABCEPers have been so
>good as to forward Wrench conversations to the ED and have been allowed to
>post the response. I believe that the responses have been helpful and
>appropriate every time that I remember. Why should the 3rd party have to do
>this? Why can't it be straight to the horse and straight back from the
>horse's mouth?
>
>Frankly, I don't believe that Ezra or the other board members should be
>expected or required to answer on behalf of the organization or to forward a
>conversation and wait for a reply. I sit on a tech committee with a couple
>other Wrenches, and I ain't about to speak on behalf of the organization.
>
>NABCEP is of, to, by, and for Wrenches. Always has been. Let's keep it that
>way.
>
>$0.020001,
>
>Matt Lafferty
>gilligan06 at gmail.com
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org
>[mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Michael
>Welch
>Sent: Friday, February 13, 2009 10:16 AM
>To: re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
>Subject: [RE-wrenches] NABCEP
>
>Hello Wrenches. As always, please contact me off list about this subject if
>you would like to weigh in.
>
>This is your list, and I run it by a consensus of your wishes. If any
>changes are to be made, I have tried to at least come close to a consensus
>among the Wrenches (not manufacturer reps) on the list. We now have a
>proposed change in policy before us.
>
>I am being placed under pressure by Ezra Auerbach to add an otherwise
>nonqualified NABCEP staff person, Rebecca Eaton, to the Wrench list so she
>may respond on behalf of NABCEP if Wrenches are discussing anything to do
>with the org.
>
>First, I often receive membership requests from nonqualified individuals.
>Unless they are technically proficient, they are respectfully turned down,
>and have included (among others): the general public, casual installers,
>academics, trade organization staff, union staff, and now NABCEP staff. I
>think you have clearly and appropriately drawn the line that we want pros on
>this list in order to keep the discussion quality high.
>
>Second, the only exceptions to this have been "technically proficient"
>representatives of the companies that manufacture the equipment that you
>Wrenches install -- and some time ago, we reached consensus to allow any
>fully NABCEP-certified individual, working pro or not. Ezra believes that
>the manufacturers' privilege should be extended to the NABCEP staff person.
>
>Third, I have offered Rebecca, and she accepted, the same thing I offer
>other nonqualified individuals that might some time want to post to the
>list: send your post to me, and I will post appropriate messages on their
>behalf. I have done this several times over the years and in fact, did it
>for Rebecca once already.
>
>Fourth, there are at least 3 NABCEP board members on this list. While they
>may not be prepared to respond with the nuts and bolts of NABCEP workings,
>it seems to me to be good representation on the list. At a minimum, these
>members could alert their staff, who could then respond through the
>already-available mechanism mentioned above.
>
>Until now, my efforts had been behind the scenes, but now it has come to a
>head and I need to involve you because this morning I rejected a list post
>from Ezra that was an end run around my off-list efforts. Here is that post:
>
>>Hello Wrenches,
>>
>>I'm writing to you all wearing my "Chairperson of NABCEP" hat and wishing
>to seek your collective guidance.
>>
>>The question is: Should the Executive Director of NABCEP be able to post to
>this list on matters germain to the organization?
>>
>>Following the NABCEP Rant thread our ED tried to get posting access so she
>could issue a timely and factual reply. She was turned down and as it stands
>today she can not post relevant and informative replies.
>>
>>A very long time ago this list allowed designated representatives from
>manufacturers on to this list so they could speak directly when appropriate
>and we all have learned good stuff from the ensuing dialogue.
>>
>>It seems ulitmately silly to me that NABCEP Certification "qualifies" for
>list posting access but being the ED of the organization does not.
>  >
>>Please weigh in with your collective thoughts.
>>
>>Best regards,
>>
>>Ezra Auerbach
>
>
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-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jeff Clearwater
Senior Design Engineer
NABCEP (tm) Certified Solar PV Installer
http://www.nabcep.org/
Village Power Design/NorthEast Solar Design
Turnkey Solar Design & Installation for the Commercial Sector
http://www.villagepower.com
gosolar at villagepower.com

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