Arc fault Breakers [RE-wrenches]

Allan Sindelar allan at positiveenergysolar.com
Wed Dec 21 07:08:39 PST 2005


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Ray,
I talked with your local inspector this morning because of another job up
there. (Hooray! As a result of this discussion he no longer will
automatically require a disconnect at the array.)

I asked him about the arc-fault breaker issue, ready to use the argument
below. I never got there, though, because he said that he didn't think that
the inverters were the cause, as other offgrid systems he had inspected had
passed the same test before. He suspected that the cause was either
defective breakers (he mentioned that Square D had recalled some) or wiring
errors. He did also comment that one house had SqD and the other had C-H.

So I couldn't accomplish anything on this issue. But he was reasonable and
easy to talk with, anyway.

Allan at PosNRG

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ray Walters" walters at taosnet.com

I agree Allan. The Square D data bulletin is also very informative.
Basically Arc fault breakers trip like regular breakers , 20 amp, 5
minute time delay for instance. But the Arc fault feature also shuts the
breaker off on an instanteneous surge of 75 A  or higher (line to
nuetral). Basically higher amp quick duration shorts can cause a fire
before the regular time delay breaker would trip.  AFCIs have a third
mode that they will trip (line to ground) which is at 5 amps or less.
Basically, the whole house is protected from any surges over 50 amps by
the inverter, so the house is actually safer, and Iwould say there would
even be a possibility of exempting some solar powered homes from the Arc
Fault breaker rule, if you can prove your power supply can't  surge over
75 amps.
I think it would take a lot of donuts to get our inspector to go that
far, maybe at least he'll back off enforcing this test.  The logic is on
our side:  surely we wouldn't want more surge capacity in order to trip
the protection against high surges.....Kind of like flunking a golf cart
in a crash test, because it can't reach crash speed.

Ray


>
>Ray,
>It seems to me that if the inverter can't produce enough to operate a
>tester, the inspector has to allow the home to pass without the test. I
cite
>two Code sections to support this:
>690.3 says that in case of conflicting Code sections, 690 trumps.
>690.10(A) specifically allows an inverter to supply current at levels below
>the AC disconnect rating.
>Therefore the Outback (and any listed inverter) passes, even if it can't
>supply 70 amps AC.
>Now, how are you fixed for doughnuts?
>Allan at Positive Energy
>
>
>
>Is anyone having trouble with Arc Fault Breakers not working correctly
>on Outback Power Inverters? The electrical inspector has flunked 2 jobs
>(not our work) because his special tester isn't properly tripping the
>Homeline brand AFI breakers for the bedroom circuits. The electrician
>told me they work fine with their onboard self test.
>Is this a problem with the Inspector's tester, the breaker, the
>inverters, grounding/ bonding or.....????
>
>Thanks for any feed back,
>
>Ray Walters

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