wireless internet dish/wind turbine tower [RE-wrenches]

Mon Feb 17 07:25:06 PST 2003

The 2003 economics of the Telecom Industry are not at all like the ones in
1999, trust me.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Robert Warren" <robertwarren at mail.com>
To: <RE-wrenches at topica.com>
Sent: Monday, February 17, 2003 8:55 AM
Subject: RE: wireless internet dish/wind turbine tower [RE-wrenches]

> Tom,
>  There is usually a 20 Khz or so radio frequency interference from the
> Trace and SolarBoost 50DL, but basically, it would be up to them to
> figure out how to shield their equipment.  Their stuff is likely 48 VDC,
> and as such they can easily filter the high frequency DC ripple on the
> battery side of things. It is very likely that if your inverter and
> controller are more than 100 meters away from your wind tower, there
> will be no interference other than a very weak RFI signal. You may as a
> last resort have to build a Faraday cage around the inverer, so be sure
> to cost this in when hitting them for access charges.
>  Since it is reliabilty they are after, and this will be a new
> installation, I highly recommend you tell them you need a whole new set
> of batteries, so everyone knows where they stand in regards to battery
> size, type, and age. You can always sell off your old set to someone
> else who is on a budget.
>  Matt is right about the wind blade interference. They have tried it
> here in the UK, and there was a problem of some sort, but I don't
> remember how it was resolved. I think there was some magic number
> regarding how far apart they were from each other. In terms of strength
> of towers, the wind tower is usually engineered far stronger than
> needed, but once they start putting up one dish or two, they keep
> multiplying like rabbits, and before you know it, there are 12 or more
> small dishes and gizmos up there.  So you have to make sure you still
> have access to your wind genny if you ever have to climb or lay down
> your tower. They are used to paying for new towers, this would be the
> better option. You still have the land and provide them with the power,
> and still get to do the work and charge them a monthly fee for access,
> power, and rental.  Or, another approach, which will win you a lot of
> repeat business, is to size a dedicated PV ssytem to their equipement,
> and have the PV on the side of the new tower. This option, though,
> really boils down to whether or not you are willing to give up good wind
> positioning compared to whatever new air turbulence you would have with
> a 2nd towere in close proximity.
> Give 'em Hell, but be nice and give 'em what they need.
> (my paraphrase of Patrick Swayze, in Roadhouse)
> Robert Warren
> robert.warren at solarcentury.co.uk
>
> matthew tritt wrote:
> > Tom,
> >
> > Wow-eeee. This sounds pretty interesting. But. One thing you might be
> > careful about is any frequency noise from the turbine blades themselves
> > (plus the alternator of course). I seem to recall that there can be some
> > weird feedback, if that's the correct word, between a parabolic receiver
> > and
> > rotating blades. This was a big problem with windfarm installations way
> > back
> > when, but perhaps your blade arc swings far enough above the dish.
> >
> > Around here, central California, I've noticed the fruits of a suggestion
> > I
> > made early last year to a Cell phone tower installation company, in the
> > form
> > of conventional water pumping windmills sprouting up all over the place,
> > with no plumbing at all, just 4 inconspicuous antennae sticking out of
> > the
> > side of the towers! Kee=rap. I should have protected myself somehow.
> > Pretty
> > funny, considering you have to go through all kinds of pain to put a
> > wind
> > turbine in (not to methion a cell tower!) but not a pumper!
> >
> > Is there no justice?
> >
> > Matt T
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Tom Simko" <tom at skylinesolar.com>
> > To: <RE-wrenches at topica.com>
> > Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 8:14 PM
> > Subject: wireless internet dish/wind turbine tower [RE-wrenches]
> >
> >
> > > Fellow Wrenches,
> > >
> > >  Today I had a guy drive up to my off grid place and knock on the
door.
> > The
> > > first thing out of his mouth was "I noticed your wind turbine tower",
> > > and
> > I
> > > thought it was, as  has happened many times in the past, someone that
> > > just
> > > had to know how it all (my off grid system) worked. I am always happy
to
> > > show a neophyte around my place, you never know, it may result in a
> > > sale,
> > as
> > > has  happened in the past.
> > >
> > >  It turns out he's a rep for a wireless internet company, new to my
rural
> > > area (SE Idaho), and my 50' 4 legged tower, currently occupied by a
> > Whisper
> > > H-80, very soon to be replaced by a AWP 3.6 (as soon as next week) fit
> > > the
> > > bill as to height and location for one of their network dishs. He went
> > > on
> > to
> > > say that if I gave permission, they'd come in and run a buried phone
> > > line
> >
> > > from the road to the tower base, install an 18" mesh dish 5' below the
> > tower
> > > top (from the top of the 4 legged tower its another 6' of 2 1/2" pipe
to
> > the
> > > base of the turbine itself, and as the dish would point west, and the
> > > prevailing winds are south in my area I'm not concerned
> > > aerodynamically),
> > > and all they need is an outlet to plug their repeater or whatever it
is
> > > into.
> > >
> > >   At this I laughed and told the guy that I was totally off grid and
while
> > > this may be possible it'd take some looking into, we'd need to get
some
> > > power consumption figures etc, and I'd have to figure the load on my
> > > 1200
> > > watt PV/ 1000 watt wind system. He mentioned that it shouldn't be a
> > problem,
> > > the gear in his estimation drew little power. Then I pointed out IF
the
> > > numbers worked the advantage to the company would be continuous power
> > > regardless of grid outages (pretty reliable around here, outages are
> > > brief
> > > and infrequent, darn it). He said that he'd get back to me tomorrow
with
> > > exact numbers as to how much power would be required, its a given the
> > > need
> > > would be 24/7. I suggested checking with the company engineer's to see
> > > if
> > a
> > > low voltage DC repeater was available, and then pointed out the cost
> > > effectiveness and potentially greater reliability of a simple DC
system,
> > and
> > > how a autonomous system, with its own PV panels/batteries, located on
my
> > > property, using my tower, but separate from my home power system but
> > perhaps
> > > using it as a backup, would give a very great degree of reliabilty. He
> > > thought that was a great idea, but was puzzled as to who would know
> > > about
> > > all that solar stuff, he did not realize until I took him over to the
> > > shop
> > > and showed him my current project, (pun intended) a 960 watt PV off
grid
> > > system that I had just finished putting together prior to delivery to
> > > the
> > > customers site, that I was in the business. So now it looks like not
> > > only
> > > will I lease my tower site to them, I'll sell the power equipment and
> > > install it. It gets better: I pointed out that since I have a trencher
> > > and
> > a
> > > boom truck (10 ton, 84' reach, very handy) I could handle ALL of the
> > > work.
> > > Sweeet.... They want to provide me with free internet access using
their
> > > system (1,500,000 BPS) in exchange, but I think I can keep my old
cable
> > > based provider, its adequate for my needs, costs me 35 a month
including
> > > hosting my website, and shake them down for a monthly cash payment. He
> > > mentioned they may pay as much as 200 a month if the tech problems are
> > > few
> > > or minor and if I'd be willing to sign a contract.
> > >
> > >  Anyway, first question is: anyone know if they can expect any
electronic
> > > interference from the Trace 4024SW, the SolarBoost 50DL, the soon to
be
> > > installed AWP or any other component of my off grid system?  Second
> > > question: anyone else with a wind turbine tower been approached with
an
> > > offer like this? If so, what'd they offer and how'd it work out?
> > >
> > > Already spending the money,
> > >
> > > Tom Simko
> > > Skyline Solar
> > >
> > > - - - -
> > > To send a message: RE-wrenches at topica.com
> > >
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> > >
> > > Moderator: michael.welch at homepower.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> What will we do if there is another fuel shortage?
> > >Did you know that there is a pollution free, completely
> renewable fuel which you can use right now in your own car?
> Don't replace the engine, replace the fuel.
> Check out my website on making your own fuel:
> http://running_on_alcohol.tripod.com
> robertwarren at mail.com
>
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> To send a message: RE-wrenches at topica.com
>
> Archive of previous messages: http://www.topica.com/lists/RE-wrenches/
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>
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>
> Moderator: michael.welch at homepower.com
>
>

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