[RE-wrenches] Forced air Furnace

[David Palumbo]

El Sid 10W DC pumps are great but in my experience they did not have the flow and head “oomph” for long runs for the zones on our second and third floors with our hydronic heating system (wood boiler). In our off grid house we installed El Sid’s on all 4 zones in the late 1980’s. We had recurring problems with the 2nd and 3rd floor zones (long runs) becoming air bound repeatedly after a couple of months of heavy use in the winter. Basement and 1st floor zones did not have this problem. I consulted with some plumbing and heating folks and ended up replacing the 2nd and 3rd floor zone El Sid’s with 115VAC Grundfos circ pumps. Problem solved, no more air lock problems. I had a hard time understanding that while the El Sid’s worked OK on the longer, higher head zones but did not have the power to avoid the air lock situation in our heating system. One of the plumbers explained it to me twenty something years ago BUT I don’t recall his explanation now. Maybe some wrench with more hydronic chops than I can explain it.

Dave Palumbo
Independent Power
Hyde Park, VT

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From: Bradley Bassett
Sent: Friday, September 7, 2018 10:09 PM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Forced air Furnace

I have multiple ElSid pumps in my heating system which have been running for just about 15 years without the slightest hitch. At 10W each they are hard to beat, but they do need DC so a power supply is needed. I ran them off 24VDC direct from the battery for the first 10 years and from a small MeanWell power supply for the last 5 years. My only complaint is that when there are 4 of them running it sounds like a miniature WWII bomber. No loud enough to hear outside of the utility room but something to keep in mind.

Brad Bassett
AEE Solar

Brad

On Fri, Sep 7, 2018 at 7:33 AM Drake <drake.chamberlin at redwoodalliance.org> wrote:
Dana, 

Your comments, and other comments on this list have made me see the light. We are going to go with a boiler. 

What is the best source of equipment for this application these days? 

Many years ago, I helped install a system in Colorado using El Sid pumps, with guidance from you, if you recall this ancient history. 

Cheers,

Drake 

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
OH License 44810
CO License 3773
NABCEP Certified Solar PV 
740-448-7328
http://athens-electric.com/ 


At 07:43 PM 8/23/2018, you wrote:

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Drake,
All the conventional units I have amp clamped over the years are pushing 900-900+ watts per hour. I do not recommend them ever & to date I have never found a lower wattage blower. I would assume that a permanent magnet motor would fit this suggestion, but I have not found one.
For off grid I recommend: Radiant floor heat first and hot water base board second long before hot air. Air is a better insulator than a heat transfer agent.
The new ECM (electronically commutated motors) pump motors are basically at DC permanent magnet motor power draws [Taco & Grundfoss] these days.
 
Best of luck with this one.
 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dana Orzel                              Great Solar Works, Inc. 
C - 208.721.7003                       dana at solarwork.com
Idaho Contractor - # 028765         Idaho PV # 028374
NABCEP # 051112-136                       www.solarwork.biz
"Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988"  
P Please consider the environment before printing this email.
 
 
From: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org> On Behalf Of Drake
Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2018 2:37 PM
To: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Forced air Furnace
 
Hello Wrenches,
What is the best choice for a propane, forced air furnace for an off grid house? We would prefer one that doesn't have a phantom load, although the transformer for the thermostat may not be avoidable. Low blower current would be preferable. The furnace AC will be powered by a Magnum 4448 PAE.
Thank you,
Drake 
Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
OH License 44810
CO License 3773
NABCEP Certified Solar PV 
740-448-7328
http://athens-electric.com/ 
 
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