[RE-wrenches] Off Grid
Ray Walters
ray at solarray.com
Mon May 12 09:58:25 PDT 2025
I had many more failures with the VFX inverters, but at least we could
rebuild them in the field. I think the old Trace stuff was the pinacle
of reliability. I still have many SWs going well over 20 years. I had
great luck with Magnum, until I got my first dud last year. Now they're
out, but I'm installing a used one soon.
I'm really at a loss as to what to deploy at this point. The AIOs are
not the answer for offgrid, but I'm going to give a Midnite Rosie a try
next, I think. I've been happy with Midnite's 600 v Charge Controllers,
except don't use them on 24v! (48v only)
I've tried some Victron stuff, which also requires a phone app and blue
tooth to program. Manuals could definitely use more info, and tech
support has been non existent. I use them for small projects (inverter
< 2 kW) for now.
Ray Walters
Remote Solar
On 5/12/2025 9:52 AM, Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches wrote:
>
> Was Outback woes.
>
> Hi Ray,
>
> I agree completely. Off grid reached its peak reliability and then
> declined. I thought it peaked with the VFX and Radian inverters, both
> of which could have stood some improvements. With the VFXR and the
> Radian A, The inverters seemed to be made more cheaply and more prone
> to problems. The rest is history.
>
> The reliance on cell phones and internet seems to me to be completely
> against the spirit of self reliant off grid systems. In the old days,
> I would set up a system and after a bit (or lot) of messing around
> would work for years.
>
> What is the best off grid inverter to use these days?
>
> Thank you,
>
> Drake
>
> /Drake Chamberlin/
>
> /Athens Electric LLC/
>
> /Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810/
>
> /NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional/
>
> ---
>
>
> On 2025-05-11 14:37, Ray Walters via RE-wrenches wrote:
>
>> I agree Michael, my call backs and free trips are way up with Li
>> batteries and AIO. I just don't know what the system is doing or
>> what to expect from the settings. Dark Start has now become a normal
>> thing. My blood pressure is off the charts trying to talk to tech
>> support with one bar of cell service. I have a DC power supply and
>> inverter to restart the batts. I now own a PC laptop that's sole
>> purpose is firmware updates.
>>
>> Guess what? Lead acid almost never needed a trip out to restart. The
>> sun comes out, and it starts recharging. Lead acid is SELF HEALING. I
>> just can't get LVD settings that keep Li bats out of dark start
>> territory. All is fine until its not. Here's some experiences:
>>
>> 1) A Fortress firmware glitch that shut the whole system down when it
>> reached 100% SOC.
>> Result: rotten food in both freezers, customer confidence: they sold
>> the property.
>> Solution: upgrade Fortress Firmware.
>>
>> 2) Simpliphi and XW system works fine for 5 years, then a low battery
>> issue during bad weather causes all 4 Simpliphi batteries to fry.
>> Result: customer is on generator full time for 2 months.
>> Solution: finally get replacement batteries and replace XW inverter
>> with Magnum.
>>
>> 3) Homegrid batteries go into dark mode after solar shuts off for a
>> couple of days. No battery voltage to turn on charge controller
>> again. Result: 3 trips out to restart batteries, and hang out for
>> hours to make sure the inverter will reconnect, and stay connected.
>> Solution: still not sure, I raised the LVD and reconnect voltages,
>> but the battery's no load draw from the BMS seems to be very
>> significant.
>>
>> 4) Midnite AIO won't connect to phone app, which is the only way to
>> program it. I turn on the inverter, and it just bricks.
>> Result: It can't function out of the box without being setup with the
>> phone app that doesn't always work.
>> Solution: after 2-1/2 hours on a bad connection with Tech support, we
>> finally get the inverter to reset and start working properly. I had
>> to delete and reload the phone app 5 times before it would finally
>> connect to the inverter. What's going to happen when you come back
>> in 5 years with a different phone?
>>
>> I can share more with other companies I've tried including Rubix, and
>> Blue Planet. The only Li battery I've not had trouble with was LiFe
>> Blue (thanks Larry), but they're only for 12v systems. I am still
>> installing lead acid for many of my customers, because we know what
>> to expect. A lesser evil is better than the unknown that can be much
>> worse. Retirement can't come too soon.
>>
>> Ray Walters
>> Remote Solar
>>
>> On 5/11/2025 9:47 AM, Michael Morningstar via RE-wrenches wrote:
>>> I wonder where all this is going? A plethora of Chinese ( I
>>> understand virtually everything electronic is manufactured there)
>>> AIOs and batteries, each with their own communication protocols,
>>> programing parameters, and individual peculiarities. I say this with
>>> all modesty and humility, that until a few years ago, it was a rare
>>> troubleshooting situation that I needed guidance from tech support
>>> for most anything. Now the extent of my prowess has been reduced to:
>>> "power cycle" it and if that doesn't work call tech support, and
>>> then be prepared for a frustrating, protracted, and costly in terms
>>> of my time, experience.
>>> I also wonder if it's sort of a "race to the bottom" (thanks for
>>> that one Bob-O) as far a quality goes. Discover discontinued it's
>>> AES battery which I think was the pinnacle, and replaced it with the
>>> Helios (which I have high hopes for). I'm hoping it's not a clone of
>>> all the others that are similar and I understand that the AES simply
>>> couldn't compete.
>>> Just my mind dump sans edit
>>>
>>> On Sun, May 11, 2025 at 8:17 AM Jay <jay.peltz at gmail.com
>>> <mailto:jay.peltz at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Fortress and eg4 both use the same basic LUX made inverters.
>>> Sol ark is made by DEYE.
>>>
>>>> On May 11, 2025, at 8:04 AM, Michael Morningstar via
>>>> RE-wrenches <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
>>>> <mailto:re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> How does the Lux, Envy, and Sol-Ark compare to Midnite's AIO? I
>>>> was all on board the Midnite train but I'm coming to the
>>>> conclusion that they released it prematurely. Glitchy and Quirky.
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, May 11, 2025 at 7:40 AM Jay via RE-wrenches
>>>> <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
>>>> <mailto:re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> One of the things I like about the LUX is that you can do
>>>> programming with the built in display.
>>>> The online monitoring is good as Maverick says.
>>>> I also think it's way more accurate as well.
>>>> The LUX 12kw is a solid unit.
>>>> Jay
>>>>
>>>>> On May 11, 2025, at 7:35 AM, Maverick Brown via
>>>>> RE-wrenches <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
>>>>> <mailto:re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> William,
>>>>> I have both the ENVY and Radian (and XW at my own home).
>>>>> The ENVY online experience is great. It may have replaced
>>>>> the Sol-Ark online monitoring as my favorite. (I have
>>>>> installed about 20 Sol-Arks and they also have tons of
>>>>> data and a great overall online experience).
>>>>> The data collected by ENVY is far greater than OpticsRE,
>>>>> many more parameters are saved. ENVY also has a working
>>>>> smart phone App that shows more data than the now offline
>>>>> / defunct OpticsRE app.
>>>>> OpticsRE does log enough data to understand that the
>>>>> system is functioning, but the additional AC data and way
>>>>> the information is presented gives ENVY far superior
>>>>> results. I do lean more towards the way OpticsRE allows
>>>>> editing parameters on the Devices section. That's likely
>>>>> because I am more familiar with the terminology. But, The
>>>>> ENVY Inverter has a built in display / touch screen that
>>>>> allows you to edit all of the values and make the system
>>>>> work without any internet / wireless / bluetooth
>>>>> connection. That is a great fall back. I am used to the
>>>>> MATE3s, but new customers have a crazy time with learning
>>>>> how it works and where values are able to be changed. The
>>>>> ENVY App bridges that gap!
>>>>> Now the dream part is that since Outback is now owned by
>>>>> the same people that also sell the EG4 18kPV (which is
>>>>> also made by Luxpower just like the ENVY), the best of
>>>>> both worlds could come about == more data collected and an
>>>>> available and a solid smart phone app for customers that
>>>>> want such a thing.
>>>>> The screenshot of the app is straight forward and the tabs
>>>>> at the bottom show charts, alarms and settings.
>>>>> The screenshot for desktop is very detailed and you can
>>>>> scroll down on the first page and get 3-4 screenfuls of
>>>>> data for just about anything you want to know.
>>>>> Let me know if you have a specific question, I can give
>>>>> you a comparison.
>>>>> <Screenshot 2025-05-11 at 9.11.09 AM.png>
>>>>> <IMG_3420.PNG>
>>>>>
>>>>> Maverick Brown
>>>>> Off-Grid Solar Commander since 2006
>>>>> *Maverick Solar Enterprises, Inc.*
>>>>> * • Solar Commander Remote Power*
>>>>> * • SunFlow Systems Cathodic Protection
>>>>> *maverick at mavericksolar.com
>>>>> <mailto:maverick at mavericksolar.com>
>>>>> 512-460-9825
>>>>>
>>>>>> On May 10, 2025, at 9:58 PM, William Miller via
>>>>>> RE-wrenches <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
>>>>>> <mailto:re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Bought a VFXR3648 and two FXR3048s recently. They
>>>>>> actually worked! Miracle.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The client for which I am suggesting an Envy 12 instead
>>>>>> of new FM100s is really attached to Optics. Now that
>>>>>> Optics is unreliable it is easier to suggest an alternative.
>>>>>> I'd like to hear about the Envy on-line interface. Is it ok?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> William Miller
>>>>>> Miller Solar.com
>>>>>> 805-438-5600
>>>>>> www.millersolar.com <http://www.millersolar.com/>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sat, May 10, 2025 at 12:23 PM Jay via RE-wrenches
>>>>>> <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
>>>>>> <mailto:re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As a follow up.
>>>>>> Has anyone purchased a new OB inverter or CC or mate.
>>>>>> I mean specifically remote new outback company.
>>>>>> Jay
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On May 10, 2025, at 11:19 AM, Todd Cory via
>>>>>>> RE-wrenches <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
>>>>>>> <mailto:re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Well, Outback's Optics RE is down yet again, also
>>>>>>> the back up site too and also the users forum...
>>>>>>> which had a massive database of current and past
>>>>>>> problem solving archives.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What a clusterfuck this new company is.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Wise wrenches should beware of patronizing this
>>>>>>> obvious sinking ship.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Todd
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <img-0.png>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sent from Finest Planet WebMail.
>>>>>>> <img-0.png>
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>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Michael Morningstar
>>>>
>>>> Morningstar Electric Inc
>>>>
>>>> PO Box 1494
>>>>
>>>> Mount Shasta, CA 96067
>>>>
>>>> 530-921-0560
>>>>
>>>> CSLB 1116835
>>>>
>>>> mjmorningstar at gmail.com <mailto:mjmorningstar at gmail.com>
>>>>
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>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Michael Morningstar
>>>
>>> Morningstar Electric Inc
>>>
>>> PO Box 1494
>>>
>>> Mount Shasta, CA 96067
>>>
>>> 530-921-0560
>>>
>>> CSLB 1116835
>>>
>>> mjmorningstar at gmail.com <mailto:mjmorningstar at gmail.com>
>>>
>>>
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