[RE-wrenches] New Outback FXR Series as GTGBB on existing Off Grid Home

Thu Oct 24 17:12:23 PDT 2024

One of the unfortunate changes from the SW to FX /FXR inverter architecture was the elimination of two AC inputs. The whole point of a battery based inverter is for backup power, so this becomes a huge issue when a grid tied system has a grid outage long enough to necessitate generator charging. 

That is why people either opt for an external Iota style charger, or the famous "DT Kludge", which is what I have on my home system for those rare times when I need generator charging.

Todd

On Thursday, October 24, 2024 4:55pm, "Bradley Bassett via RE-wrenches" <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> said:

As I remember the FXR inverters will rarely connect to any generators beside very well controlled or inverter type generators. I agree that I don't think there is any automatic transfer from grid tie to generator input. 
Brad Bassett

On Thu, Oct 24, 2024 at 3:42 PM Wayne Irwin via RE-wrenches <[ re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org ]( mailto:re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org )> wrote:

It is my understanding that the FXR will not "automatically" switch from Grid Input to Gen. 
To my knowledge this is a manual option only.
I do not recall any way to make this happen automatically. That would have been great.
You can however still call for the generator at a low V setting and have the generator power an external charger to boost the batteries.
I think the brand we used to use was IOTA however, I have also seen golf cart chargers used.

Wayne Irwin
President
License #CVC56695
State Licensed Solar Contractor
Pure Energy Solar International Inc.
Wayne at PureEnergySolar.com
[ PureEnergySolar.com ]( http://pureenergysolar.com/ )
[ SolarChargingStation.com ]( http://solarchargingstation.com/ )
352 377-6527 Office
352 336-3299 Fax

The Sun Is Always Shining!

 The content of this message is Pure Energy Solar Confidential. If you are not the intended recipient and have received this message in error, any use or distribution is prohibited. Please notify me immediately by reply e-mail and delete this message from your computer system. Thank you.
From: RE-wrenches <[ re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org ]( mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org )> on behalf of Jay via RE-wrenches <[ re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org ]( mailto:re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org )>
Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2024 5:57 PM
To: RE-wrenches <[ re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org ]( mailto:re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org )>
Cc: Jay <[ jay.peltz at gmail.com ]( mailto:jay.peltz at gmail.com )>
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] New Outback FXR Series as GTGBB on existing Off Grid Home

Hi Jeremy
There are two issues I think. 
1 is that the inverter won’t connect. 
And I don’t have an answer why the inverter won’t in sell mode but will in gen mode. Maybe the generator is slightly out of the more narrow window for grid. I presume you’ve checked hz and volts and they are in spec for grid?  I know sometimes the frequency control can be slightly variable without a load. I’ve had success in the past getting inverters to connect to a generator with putting some dumb loads on it. Like incandescent lights or small heater. 
2. Maybe it’s a good thing it won’t because if it did connect wouldn’t it be possible for the inverter to try to sell to the generator?  If you didn’t have to change grid to Gen?
Jay

On Oct 23, 2024, at 8:47 PM, Jeremy Rodriguez via RE-wrenches <[ re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org ]( mailto:re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org )> wrote:

Wrenches, 
We have a client that has brought utility power in and we now have the system hooked up to the utility.
In setting the system up, I've experienced that the inverter will sell and function fine with all the settings set up as Grid Tied mode, but it does not play nice when the grid is gone , and the Generator is brought in as the AC source.
We have installed an external transfer switch to switch the inverters' AC input, from either the utility or the existing backup generator ( if the grid fails), automatically. 
The manual states that the inverter's two input selections can be programmed for seperate input modes, via the Input Type menu. Ive not been able to get this accomplished. 
When simulating a grid outage, thus changing the AC input to the inverter being from the Generator, the inverter will not synch to the AC power to charge the batteries. 
The only way that I can get the inverter to synch, is to switch the input mode to GEN from GRID.
This is not ideal since the client would need to be present to make the button push, even though the generator will be started automatically if the grid were to go down (hopefully) , just as it did before.

With no way to contact Outback , can someone advise how to properly program the inverter/ MATE3S for this project?   
Equipment onsite:
Single VFXR3648 inverter
Two FM60 CCs
Hub4
MATE3S
ATS with Dual Relays 50A 
L.A. Battery bank
Here's how we would like it to work:
Utility power ON: 
Sell excess power once the batteries have gone through the Absorb cycle. Batteries remain full in case of a utility failure. 
Utility Outage: 
ATS now feeds Inv AC input via Generator if needed.
Inverter runs the home as it did , off grid.
If the battery voltage drops and the AGS is engaged, the inverter will use that input to charge the batteries as usual.  If the grid comes back on and the gen is running, the generator can still run, with no connection to the inverter.  With the grid now charging the battery bank, and the AGS will enventually shut off the Gen. Based on voltage.  
Contact me off list if necessary
Jeremy Rodriguez
All Solar Inc. 
Penrose, CO
719-276-4954_______________________________________________
List sponsored by Redwood Alliance

Pay optional member dues here: [ http://re-wrenches.org ]( http://re-wrenches.org )

List Address: [ RE-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org ]( mailto:RE-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org )

Change listserver email address & settings:
[ http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org ]( http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org )

There are two list archives for searching. When one doesn't work, try the other:
[ https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/ ]( https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/ )
[ http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org ]( http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org )

List rules & etiquette:
[ http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm ]( http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm )

Check out or update participant bios:
[ http://www.members.re-wrenches.org ]( http://www.members.re-wrenches.org )

_______________________________________________
 List sponsored by Redwood Alliance

 Pay optional member dues here: [ http://re-wrenches.org ]( http://re-wrenches.org )

 List Address: [ RE-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org ]( mailto:RE-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org )

 Change listserver email address & settings:
[ http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org ]( http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org )

 There are two list archives for searching. When one doesn't work, try the other:
[ https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/ ]( https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/ )
[ http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org ]( http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org )

 List rules & etiquette:
[ http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm ]( http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm )

 Check out or update participant bios:
[ http://www.members.re-wrenches.org ]( http://www.members.re-wrenches.org )

Sent from Finest Planet WebMail.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org/attachments/20241024/8db9e4cd/attachment.htm>