[RE-wrenches] Integrating Fortress E-vault maxes into an SI AC-coupled system

Sun Nov 12 15:09:05 PST 2023

Make that 222-10 for ChrgVtgFlo, not 220-10

Kirk

On Sun, Nov 12, 2023 at 3:05 PM Kirk Bailey <kirk at abundantsolar.com> wrote:

> I went back and looked at my notes on my recent adventure with closed loop
> SI to eFlex Fortress, and one thing I had noted at the time is that
> Fortress recommends 2.2V, 2.26V, and 2.3V for the setting for ChrgVtgFlo
> (220-10), depending on which of three Fortress docs I read.  I think I
> ended up setting it to 2.26V after some experimentation.
>
> I can imagine a scenario where the voltage gets *slightly* too high,
> activating the most trigger-happy of the battery's BMS's, and the resulting
> sudden partial loss in load then causes a transitory voltage surge from the
> SI, which then...
>
> Cheers,
>
> Kirk Bailey
> kirk at abundantsolar.com
>
>
> On Sun, Nov 12, 2023 at 2:36 PM William Miller via RE-wrenches <
> re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>
>> Jay:
>>
>> Good question. I assumed some kind of FET circuit but that is only my
>> assumption.
>>
>> However an open relay exhibits some fairly high impedance.
>>
>> The symptoms indicate the SI shuts down but the batteries remain
>> connected. Something allows 69 volts on the battery terminals…
>>
>> William Miller
>> Miller Solar.com
>> 805-438-5600
>> www.millersolar.com
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Nov 12, 2023 at 2:22 PM Jay via RE-wrenches <
>> re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>>
>>> Maybe someone else knows differently but it was explained to me that the
>>> fortress batteries have a relay that disconnects the battery if the voltage
>>> gets to high or low. There isn’t any electronic  device to change battery
>>> impedance besides what the actual cells are doing.
>>>
>>> Jay
>>>
>>> On Nov 12, 2023, at 12:50 PM, Jerry Shafer via RE-wrenches <
>>> re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> 
>>> Regarding the SI Inverters,for me it works best to eliminate the bat
>>> temp sensor and put in a resister set to be 75 degrees, this will prevent
>>> the charger over under charge issue.
>>> Fun times
>>>
>>> On Sun, Nov 12, 2023, 12:36 PM William Miller via RE-wrenches <
>>> re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Friends:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I am still working on getting the E-vaults to play nice with the Sunny
>>>> Islands and Sunny Boys.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> With Open loop I was getting significant discrepancies in the reporting
>>>> of SOC in the e-vaults versus that reported by the SI inverters.  This
>>>> discrepancy did not diminish over time.  The discrepancy caused
>>>> unacceptable charging and generator operations.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I got Closed loop hooked up, but I found that every few days the SI
>>>> inverters would shut down due to a battery over-voltage condition.  I
>>>> believe that when the e-vaults are near 100% SOC the BMS units increase the
>>>> battery impedance which means any charging current applied will cause the
>>>> voltage spike I have been seeing.   I was able to measure these conditions
>>>> myself on site, although they were very fleeting and required recording
>>>> with the Fluke87 Min-Max function (love this meter!).
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I was able to extract log files from the Sunny Island primary inverter
>>>> and perform some analysis.  It appears when I turned on remote BMS on the
>>>> SI (as part of the Closed loop protocol) it disabled the Frequency-Shift
>>>> Power Control.  This means the SI inverters have gone from having poor
>>>> control over battery charging to having no control over battery charging.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I have documented my research here
>>>> <https://millersolar.com/MillerSolar/case_studies/36_SIFortress/36_SunnyIslandFortressIntegration.html#Inhibit>.
>>>> There is a table of contents to take you to the latest information.  I
>>>> appreciate pertinent comments any of you might have.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> By the way, if anyone has called SMA tech support for help on a Sunny
>>>> Island system, you have likely been asked to extract log files, zip them up
>>>> and send them off for review (and waited a long time for a reply).  I am
>>>> the kind of guy who does not like to wait for solutions and who likes to
>>>> figure out things for himself.  I have taught myself how to evaluate those
>>>> log files. I will be posting a web page on the subject.  In the meantime,
>>>> if you are interested, two of my analysis Excel sheets are linked in the
>>>> case study.  I will be expanding on this and providing resources to any
>>>> integrator that wants that knowledge.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Thanks in advance for any insight.  I hope I am wrong about this and I
>>>> am just missing something.  I also hope revealing my headaches will help
>>>> someone someday…
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> William
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Miller Solar
>>>>
>>>> 17395 Oak Road, Atascadero, CA 93422
>>>>
>>>> 805-438-5600
>>>>
>>>> www.millersolar.com
>>>>
>>>> CA Lic. 773985
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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