[RE-wrenches] Sunny Island grid tie battery back and backup stability issues with ABB

Tue Sep 19 07:02:00 PDT 2017

My memory was that there was a software switch that shut off the frequency
shift which is specifically used to attempt to control AC coupled
inverters, but I could be mistaken - it's been a couple of years since I
programmed a SI.  In any case, the unstable frequency doesn't sound like a
feature. Let us know what you find...
Howie

On Tue, Sep 19, 2017 at 9:53 AM, August Goers <august at luminalt.com> wrote:

> Thanks for the input. Jerry and Howie, you may be referring to the Sunny
> Island's automatic frequency synchronization mode. This allows the Sunny
> Island to adjust the frequency to keep clocks accurate. The setting is
> 250.11 AfraEna and we already have that disabled. My understanding is that
> the Sunny Island will boost frequency if it purposely wants to kick the
> inverters off if the batteries are full or if the Sunny Island is
> overloaded with too much power. In our case, we're just seeing a very
> unstable voltage and frequency. I have the service codes for the ABB
> inverters and I'm going to test those out today to see if widening the
> voltage or frequency parameters make any difference. Regardless, it doesn't
> seem like a good idea to leave the system as-is if the voltage and
> frequency are not stable.
>
> August
>
>
>
> On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 7:27 PM, Howie Michaelson <
> Howie.Michaelson at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> To follow up on Jerry's note,if the SI is shifting to regulate the
>> incoming charge from the AC coupled inverter, and you don't want this to
>> happen, I believe there is a software switch that will turn this feature
>> off.
>> And Jerry, have you seen the SI replacement you referred to? Can you say
>> anything else about it?
>> Howie
>>
>> Howie Michaelson
>> NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer™
>> Sun Catcher, LLC
>> Solar Energy Systems Sales and Service
>> VT Solar Electric Incentive Partner
>> 802-272-0004 <(802)%20272-0004>
>>
>> On Sep 18, 2017 10:14 PM, "Jerry Shafer" <jerrysgarage01 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Luminalt
>> As l recall the SI will move the freq around to regulate the SMA
>> inverter, not having a SMA it may be attempting to force the inverter down.
>> You can widen the freq programming on the ABB inverter to prevent the shut
>> down but this will not prevent the volts from bouncing around, you may want
>> to adjust the inverter AC volts to get past the wave.. FYI, SMA will
>> shortly have a replacement for the SI thats 240 vac and alot smarter too.
>> Jerry
>>
>> On Sep 18, 2017 1:26 PM, "Peter Giroux" <pgiroux at mindspring.com> wrote:
>>
>>> August
>>>
>>>   We had something similar happen a few years ago on an AC coupled
>>> application using a 5048 Sunny Island ( with transformer ) and a Sunny Boy
>>> 7000. In a grid down scenario the Sunny boy dropped off line.  After a few
>>> calls with SMA sharing the error codes it turned out the Sunny Island was
>>> not delivering 60 hertz, not even 59, so we had to reprogram the Sunny Boy
>>> to recognize and run on 57 hertz.
>>>
>>>   SMA was gracious enough to share the "magic code " and walk me through
>>> the programming. Once the Sunny Boy was reset to operate on the lower hertz
>>> range everything worked great. You may have a similar situation, not sure
>>> if the ABB folks will help with the hertz adjustment but you should give it
>>> a try before springing for a sunny boy.
>>>
>>> Peter Giroux
>>> ASAE
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> *From:* August Goers <august at luminalt.com>
>>> *To:* RE-wrenches <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>
>>> *Sent:* Monday, September 18, 2017 5:48 PM
>>> *Subject:* [RE-wrenches] Sunny Island grid tie battery back and backup
>>> stability issues with ABB
>>>
>>> Hi Wrenches -
>>>
>>> We have an ~3 year old grid tied battery backup system with a SMA Sunny
>>> Island 4548 and Power-One (now ABB) PVI-5000 inverter. There is also an
>>> Outback PSX-240 to boost the Sunny Island voltage to 240 volts.
>>>
>>> We recently returned to the site for an annual service call and tested
>>> the system by simulating a power outage. The Sunny Island kicked in just
>>> fine and provided stable voltage for the backup loads. However, the ABB
>>> tries to connect and immediately we see that voltage and frequency of the
>>> Sunny Island grid start to rapidly fluctuate. I have a feeling that my
>>> Fluke meter is not capturing the fluctuations properly, but I was seeing
>>> voltage fluctuate in the 238 to 242 volt range and frequency rapidly
>>> fluctuate between 59 and 61 Hz.
>>>
>>> The ABB connects for a minute or two and then gives us a grid out of
>>> range error. This occurs when we have lots of irradiance and also under
>>> relatively low light conditions. I've already been on the phone with SMA
>>> tech support several times and verified that all the Sunny Island settings
>>> are good.
>>>
>>> Has anyone else seen this type of instability issue and did you find a
>>> fix? We might need to install a Sunny Boy.
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> August
>>>
>>> *August Goers*
>>>
>>> Luminalt
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance
>>>
>>> List Address: RE-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
>>>
>>> Change listserver email address & settings:
>>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
>>>
>>> List-Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/re
>>> -wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html
>>>
>>> List rules & etiquette:
>>> www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm
>>>
>>> Check out or update participant bios:
>>> www.members.re-wrenches.org
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance
>>>
>>> List Address: RE-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
>>>
>>> Change listserver email address & settings:
>>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
>>>
>>> List-Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/re
>>> -wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html
>>>
>>> List rules & etiquette:
>>> www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm
>>>
>>> Check out or update participant bios:
>>> www.members.re-wrenches.org
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance
>>
>> List Address: RE-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
>>
>> Change listserver email address & settings:
>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
>>
>> List-Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/re
>> -wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html
>>
>> List rules & etiquette:
>> www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm
>>
>> Check out or update participant bios:
>> www.members.re-wrenches.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance
>>
>> List Address: RE-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
>>
>> Change listserver email address & settings:
>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
>>
>> List-Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/re
>> -wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html
>>
>> List rules & etiquette:
>> www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm
>>
>> Check out or update participant bios:
>> www.members.re-wrenches.org
>>
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance
>
> List Address: RE-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
>
> Change listserver email address & settings:
> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
>
> List-Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.
> org/maillist.html
>
> List rules & etiquette:
> www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm
>
> Check out or update participant bios:
> www.members.re-wrenches.org
>
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org/attachments/20170919/622de9ba/attachment-0002.html>