[RE-wrenches] Array/battery relationship (WAS Battery Watt hours FLA VS Iron Edison Batteries)

Fri Oct 14 15:32:46 PDT 2016

Hi Allen,

I use the 2-3 day autonomy design approach as well unless there are unusual
circumstances.  Here in western Colorado this design approach has worked
very well.  I have been met with some resistance with folks that are used
to the large 4-5 battery string designs that were common around here.
Regarding battery longevity, I think the thing that we struggle with is
making sure the batteries stay cool enough in the summer & warm enough in
the winter.  I haven't found an approach that works perfect.

It seems to me like chronic undercharging is a bigger problem than higher
currents introduced by modern array designs.

Thanks

On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 3:55 PM, Allan Sindelar <allan at sindelarsolar.com>
wrote:

> Dana (and I'm curious if others agree),
> I used to work with 4-5 days of storage, back with modules were expensive
> and batteries were relatively cheap. As in recent years these two have
> reversed - modules are cheap and batteries are dear - my fundamental design
> approach has changed. I now design around 2-3 days of storage with a larger
> array, as long as there's a backup generator in the system. I size to at
> least 100% of the projected winter average daily load.
>
> The batteries recharge more quickly, including on partly cloudy days
> between storms. They spend more of their time full, thus keeping them
> happier and giving them as much or more life, even with more and deeper
> cycling. FLAs are easier to EQ, given the hotter charge rate. And the
> customer spends less.
>
> You used to live in SW Colorado, a similar sunny winter climate. Is it the
> same in Idaho where you live now?
> Allan
>
>
> *Allan Sindelar*
> allan at sindelarsolar.com
> NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional
> NABCEP Certified Technical Sales Professional
> New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician
> Founder (Retired), Positive Energy, Inc.
> *505 780-2738 <505%20780-2738> cell*
>
>
> On 10/14/2016 3:36 PM, Dana wrote:
>
> I recommend 4 days backup min & 5 days backup if budget allows of storage
> and Iron Edison were saying that 2 days was sufficient. To clarify - I said
> “magical” as in wondering if there was something special, I-E did not say
> this.
>
>
>
> __________________________________________________________
>
> Dana Orzel
>
> Great Solar Works, Inc -  NABCEP # 051112-136
>
> dana at solarwork.com  - www.solarwork.biz <http://www.solarwork.com>
>
> *O* - 970.626.5253    *F* - 970.626.4140   c *- *208.721.7003
>
> *"Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988**"  *
>
>
>
> *From:* RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org
> <re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org>] *On Behalf Of *Dan Fink
> *Sent:* Friday, October 14, 2016 12:04 PM
> *To:* RE-wrenches
> *Subject:* Re: [RE-wrenches] Battery Watt hours FLA VS Iron Edison
> Batteries
>
>
>
> Tom; I have never seen Iron Edison saying NiFe is "magical" -- do you have
> a specific webpage on their site that says this?
>
> All batteries have advantages and disadvantages, and also myriad technical
> issues for the installer to overcome.
>
>
>
>
> Dan Fink
>
> Adjunct Professor of Solar Energy Technology, Ecotech Institute
>
> IREC Certified Instructor™ for:
>
> ~ PV Installation Professional
>
> ~ Small Wind Installer
>
> Executive Director, Buckville Energy
>
> NABCEP Registered Continuing Education Providers™
> 970.672.4342
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 10:14 AM, Tom Duffy <Tom at solar-biz.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Dana
>
>
>
> Two thoughts… how many days of autonomy are they quoting?
>
>
>
> If nickel Iron were this magical how come nobody has noticed them for the
> past 100 years?
>
>
>
> Kind regards
>
>
>
> *Tom Duffy*
>
> *Senior Solar Design Engineer*
>
> [image: Solar-Biz-new-logo-800X300]
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> *From:* RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] *On
> Behalf Of *Dana
> *Sent:* Friday, October 14, 2016 8:56 AM
> *To:* 'RE-wrenches' <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>
> *Subject:* [RE-wrenches] Battery Watt hours FLA VS Iron Edison Batteries
>
>
>
> Good Morning All,
>
>
>
> I have a charity case client that needs 760 to 900 AHR at 24 VDC. I have
> installed HUP Solar One Batteries for 20+ years and do not have any
> experience with the Iron Edison battery. My client went to Iron Edison &
> was told that 360 AHR at 24 VDC would cover the same AHR as a 760 to 900
> AHR in FLA.  I understand you can use the IE deeper typically than a FLA.
>
>
>
> Math is math to me & how I have sized [successfully for years] Is there
> something I am missing or has my client been misinformed?
>
>
>
> __________________________________________________________
>
> Dana Orzel
>
> Great Solar Works, Inc -  NABCEP # 051112-136
>
> dana at solarwork.com  - www.solarwork.biz <http://www.solarwork.com>
>
> *O* - 970.626.5253    *F* - 970.626.4140   c *- *208.721.7003
>
> *"Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988**"  *
>
>
>
>
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-- 

Mac Lewis

*"Yo solo sé que no sé nada." -Sócrates*
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