[RE-wrenches] Generac Ecogen (was RE: generator suggestions)

Drake drake.chamberlin at redwoodalliance.org
Sun Jul 7 12:11:59 PDT 2013 

A client has already purchased one of these and I 
plan to hook it up soon. Although I generally 
advise customers to avoid automatic starting, 
this unit needs to auto start. It would be an 
issue if the unit really has a 50 W phantom load that runs 24/7.

It seems that there are different ideas 
concerning the magnitude of this draw. Does 
anyone know for sure if it will, or will not use 
that much energy in the auto start position?  50 
Wh/hr X 24 = 1.2 KW/Day. The generator would run 
at times to feed its own phantom loads.

Thanks,

Drake



At 01:35 PM 7/7/2013, you wrote:
>Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
>         boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0065_01CE7B16.D9D73620"
>Content-Language: en-us
>
>Jay –
>
>I’ve done this before with the Kohler RES 
>series to eliminate the phantom in auto-mode, 
>BUT stressing to all that the generator could 
>start automatically without notice – especially 
>to the generator tech. As always, best to 
>disconnect the starting battery when servicing.
>
>Kirk Herander
>VT Solar, LLC
>dba Vermont Solar Engineering
>NABCEPTM Certified Inaugural Certificant
>NYSERDA-eligible Installer
>VT RE Incentive Program Partner
>802.863.1202
>
>From: re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org 
>[mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of jay peltz
>Sent: Sunday, July 07, 2013 9:58 AM
>To: RE-wrenches
>Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Generac Ecogen (was RE: generator suggestions)
>
>Hi Kirk
>
>One trick I learned from my generator guy is to 
>hook up the remote start to the manual on position
>This bypass's the auto position and the extra load on the battery
>
>Best I can tell only difference on the Koehler 
>anyway is how fast it starts. On auto right now
>On manual a few seconds delay.
>
>Jay
>
>Peltz power
>
>Sent from my iPad
>
>On Jul 6, 2013, at 10:46 AM, "Kirk Herander" 
><<mailto:kirk at vtsolar.com>kirk at vtsolar.com> wrote:
>Alan and others,
>
>I have an off-grid customer looking at the 
>Ecogen. Now that 6 months have passed since your 
>comments, can you tell us more of the pros and cons of this unit?
>I read somewhere the phantom load of the 
>controller (and charger?) is 20 to 50 watts 
>total. Is it just the controller which needs to 
>stay awake? Is there a separate charger for the 
>battery, meaning no alternator / rectifier 
>direct from the engine? Regardless,  it seems 
>dumb to me that a generator designed for 
>off-grid would mandate a phantom load to 
>operate. For that reason, it seems no more 
>appealing than the Kohler R series. Is there an 
>on-board hour-meter? Thanks. The brochure does not address these questions.
>
>Kirk Herander
>VT Solar, LLC
>dba Vermont Solar Engineering
>NABCEPTM Certified Inaugural Certificant
>NYSERDA-eligible Installer
>VT RE Incentive Program Partner
>802.863.1202
>
>From: 
><mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org>re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org 
>[mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Allan Sindelar
>Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 3:21 PM
>To: RE-wrenches
>Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] generator suggestions
>
>Ray,
>Everything has changed. The Kohler 6.5RMY and 
>the Onan 6.5 Commercial were wonderful units, 
>but also both flathead twins, eventually 
>discontinued for efficiency and emissions 
>reasons, as I came to understand. Also, the 
>American residential market was (and remains) 
>almost exclusively about home standby, not off 
>grid, and the major manufacturers went in that 
>direction. Home standby is a competitive market, 
>and generators aren't expected to run for many 
>hours over their useful life, so internals can 
>be cheapened and features to make them more like 
>a home appliance are added. Many of us have 
>customer horror stories about home standby units used off grid.
>
>I have written favorably about the Generac 
>EcoGen here and in Home Power, as it's pretty 
>much currently the only under-10K unit designed 
>for off grid use. I have now had two at my home 
>- we had a fire in May that took out an 
>outbuilding and the gennie, and I replaced it 
>with the same model, because it had performed 
>well and there was nothing else to compete with 
>it. Always starts, minimal maintenance, exceeds 
>its rated output on occasion, doesn't require a 
>separate enclosure, and is sealed against mice. 
>Oh, and very quiet. So far the only disadvantage 
>is the need for either an AC feed for the 8W 
>phantom load to keep the controller awake, but a 
>PV module and small controller on the starting 
>battery will handle that one of these days. It's 
>not just one of their standard units with 
>different bells and whistles, but has hardened 
>valves, lower (2,500) rpm, longer maintenance 
>intervals, and other reliability features.
>
>I know all about Generac's otherwise-poor 
>reputation, and am willing to stick my neck out 
>about this model, as I think it's the best we 
>currently have in this size range. My 
>understanding is that the Propane Reliability 
>Council (or some similar organizational name) 
>was involved with sponsoring development of an 
>LP gennie tough enough to handle off grid 
>demands. They first approached Kohler, who 
>turned them down, and then worked with Generac 
>(all this is hearsay; don't quote me on it).
>Allan
>Allan Sindelar
><mailto:Allan at positiveenergysolar.com>Allan at positiveenergysolar.com
>NABCEP Certified Photovoltaic Installer
>NABCEP Certified Technical Sales Professional
>New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician
>Founder and Chief Technology Officer
>Positive Energy, Inc.
>3209 Richards Lane (note new address)
>Santa Fe, New Mexico 87507
>505 424-1112
><http://www.positiveenergysolar.com/>www.positiveenergysolar.com
>
>
>On 1/30/2013 10:41 AM, Ray Walters wrote:
>Hi Randy and all;
>
>I definitely like the water cooled 1800 rpm 
>machines too, but for regular off grid homes, 
>they just are way out of the budget.  We jumped 
>on the inverter generator band wagon for a 
>while, but had the same load issues Allan 
>described.  (Microwave kicks the breaker, and 
>you're running the genny for hours for 
>nothing)  Many customers have turned to the 
>contractor portables with equally disappointing 
>results, but often they already have the genny, 
>and we just provide an inlet box and cord.
>The Generac looks like a good idea, I wish Onan 
>or Kohler would build one. Kohler used to make a 
>6.5 Kw that fit the one inverter household fairly well.
>
>Ray Walters
>
>THeOn 1/30/2013 8:55 AM, Larry Crutcher, Starlight Solar Power Systems wrote:
>Randy,
>
>I concur, the Cummins/Onan generators are built 
>well and are reliable. They provide a 1 year, 
>1000 hour warranty for off grid use when a RE 
>system is installed for primary power.
>
>We install lots of Magnum Energy inverters with 
>AGS modules in RV's. What sold me on the Onan's 
>is having seen many RV generators (3600, 2880 
>and 2400 RPM), some with several thousand hours, 
>still operating with tight frequency and voltage 
>control, no leaks, easy starting, etc.
>
>Larry Crutcher
>Starlight Solar Power Systems
>
>
>
>
>
>
>On Jan 30, 2013, at 7:52 AM, Randy Brooks wrote:
>
>Todd,
>
>We don't sell or install generators, but the 
>only one I recommend for permanent installations 
>is the Cummins/Onan, 1,800 rpm, propane fueled.  All others have failed early.
>
>Good luck,
>
>Randy Brooks
>Brooks Solar, Inc.
>Solar Power for People
>140 Columbia View
>Chelan, WA  98816
>509-682-9646
><mailto:Randy at BrooksSolar.com>Randy at BrooksSolar.com
>www.BrooksSolar.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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