[RE-wrenches] wrenches] Husqvarna 5500 and VFX3524Compatibility question
boB
boB at midnitesolar.com
Sat Feb 2 12:31:52 PST 2013
On 2/1/2013 7:42 AM, John Berdner wrote:
>
> John:
>
> If doing an AC coupled system with SB/SI there a couple things to
> consider.
>
> 1)SI is 120 Vac only and SB and grid are both 240. You can get 2 SI's
> but that is pricey. SMA now makes an autoformer (finally) but it is
> really big and pretty expensive (hey Robin/Bob there is an opportunity
> here). Too bad they don't make a 240 Vac SI and no longer make the
> old 1800 which had a 120 Vac output.
>
Already doing that, John, as part off our SMA/SI/SB and battery based
integration package just starting to ship now.
Thanks !!
boB
> A couple of ways to wire this (ASCII Draw, >> indicate power flow, <>
> indicates bidirectional):
>
> PV >> SB >> Protected Load Center <> Auto former <> SI <> Xfer switch
> <>Grid.
>
> | |
>
> | >> Loads | <<<
> Generator
>
> Or alternatively like this:
>
> PV >> SB >> Protected Load Center <> Xfer switch <>Auto former <> SI
> << Generator
>
> | |
>
> | >> Loads | <> Grid
>
> A couple of tradeoffs here:
>
> In case 1 the downside is that the output of the SI is 120 Vac to the
> grid = imbalance. All your grid tied PV flows through the auto-former
> with the associated losses. The upside is that your protected loads
> are protected by the SI which has a very fast (transparent) transfer.
>
> In case 2 the downside is that the loads are not protected so you will
> see an interruption when the xfer switch transfers. With a manual
> xfer switch this interruption could be a long time J The upside is
> the PV is connected directly to the grid @ 240Vac normally with no
> autoformer losses
>
> If the SI is already installed you probably are doing something like
> this already.
>
> To connect in a generator you have to understand the SI's grid input
> programming. The SI has only one physical grid "input". I say
> "input" because both side of an SI are bi-directional and can be
> either and input or an output depending on power flow. If you go with
> Case 1 The problem is that you need to set the current limit high
> enough for the SB so it can grid feed. If your SB is larger than your
> generator you can overload the generator when in backup mode. You
> also need to allow power flow out of the grid input which you don't
> want with a small generator. It is also nice to have wider voltage and
> frequency limits when operating with the generator. Fortunately
> there are 2 logical inputs for the single grid input and a digital
> generator mode selector input (signal level) that is used to switch
> between the two. Each of these logical inputs can have different
> parameters, i.e. one for grid and one for generator. You provide a
> feedback a signal to the digital input mode selector to tell the SI
> which set of parameters to use.
>
> There are several ways to do the mode selection ranging from a switch
> (light switch or toggle switch) near the SI to select modes to an aux
> contact on a full auto xfer relay.
>
> For a low case bulletproof approach use a 3 phase manual xfer switch
> and use the unused third power pole to do your digital input mode
> switching. This is what I have at my house. The grid feeds one side
> of the manual Xfer switch and I have an SO cord on the other side to
> plug in to a generator for charging during a prolonged outage.
>
> Feel free to contact me either online or offline if you have questions.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> John Berdner
>
> General Manager, North America
>
> SmallBannerPictEngnew
>
> SolarEdge Technologies, Inc.
>
> 3347 Gateway Boulevard, Fremont CA 94538 USA */(*Please note of our
> new address.)/*
> T: 510.498.3200, X 747
>
> M: 530.277.4894
>
> *From:*re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org
> [mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] *On Behalf Of *john
> *Sent:* Friday, February 01, 2013 4:12 AM
> *To:* re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
> *Subject:* Re: [RE-wrenches] wrenches] Husqvarna 5500 and VFX3524
> Compatibility question
>
> John,
>
> Thanks for that bit of information. I have a customer with a SB5000
> and recently added a Sunny Island with 8 L16 batteries. This answers
> their question as to what they will do in an extended outage with no
> sun. I wanted to suggest a small backup generator but wasn't sure how
> it would work. Now I can install the cord and set the sunny island
> for a Honda 2000i, several of which I keep on hand for emergency power
> for us and our customers.
>
> John Blittersdorf
>
> /NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer ^tm /
>
> *Central Vermont Solar & Wind LLC*
>
> 104 River Street
>
> Rutland, VT 05701
>
> 802-770-8625 Cell
>
> 802-747-0577 Office
>
> 802-773-0924 Fax
>
> Mark your calendar: SolarFest 2013, July 12, 13 &
> 14www.SolarFest.org <http://www.solarfest.org/>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Berdner <John.Berdner at solaredge.com
> <mailto:John.Berdner at solaredge.com>>
> To: Allan <Allan at positiveenergysolar.com
> <mailto:Allan at positiveenergysolar.com>>; RE-wrenches
> <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
> <mailto:re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>>
> Sent: Thu, Jan 31, 2013 8:20 pm
> Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Husqvarna 5500 and VFX3524 Compatibility
> question
>
> SMA Sunny Island also does this but also discharges battery in
> parallel with the generator to create a "virtual generator" that is
> larger than the actual generator.
>
> Just set the max generator current and it does the rest.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> John Berdner
>
> General Manager, North America
>
> SmallBannerPictEngnew
>
> SolarEdge Technologies, Inc.
>
> 3347 Gateway Boulevard, Fremont CA 94538 USA */(*Please note of our
> new address.)/*
> T: 510.498.3200, X 747
>
> M: 530.277.4894
>
> *From:*re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org
> <mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org>
> [mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org
> <mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org?>] *On Behalf Of
> *Allan Sindelar
> *Sent:* Thursday, January 31, 2013 2:14 PM
> *To:* William Miller
> *Cc:* RE-wrenches
> *Subject:* Re: [RE-wrenches] Husqvarna 5500 and VFX3524 Compatibility
> question
>
> William,
> Yes, that's my understanding. Outback acknowledged this to me years ago.
> Allan
>
> *Allan Sindelar*
> Allan at positiveenergysolar.com <mailto:Allan at positiveenergysolar.com>
> NABCEP Certified Photovoltaic Installer
> NABCEP Certified Technical Sales Professional
> New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician
> Founder and Chief Technology Officer
> *Positive Energy, Inc.*
> 3209 Richards Lane (note new address)
> Santa Fe, New Mexico 87507
> *505 424-1112*
> www.positiveenergysolar.com <http://www.positiveenergysolar.com/>
>
> On 1/29/2013 9:28 PM, William Miller wrote:
>
> Allan:
>
> Could it be that the SW systems are protecting the generator with
> Generator Support, and the Outback inverters are not?
>
> William Miller
>
>
>
> At 07:18 PM 1/29/2013, you wrote:
>
> This is going back several years...
>
> The Outback VFX series lacks the tight input current regulation of
> the SW series, so the max AC amps in is really just a suggestion.
> In many cases (and especially with these small generators) we want
> to set the max amps in as high as possible to minimize charging
> time and maximize C/rate. Yet a surge load can momentarily exceed
> the max amps setting.
>
> I have observed that the Honda inverter/generators have a quite
> sensitive AC output breaker, that will sometimes trip if a surge
> load (such as a refrigerator) comes on during a charge cycle set
> close to the generator's capacity. This incident was specific to a
> Honda 3000i. In contrast, Yamaha's EF3000iSE will lug when
> overloaded - not good for the generator, but also not likely to
> trip the output breaker.
>
> This is a different issue than was being discussed, but fits your
> question.
> Allan
>
>
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