[RE-wrenches] Air conditioning for batteries in high temperature climate

[Darryl Thayer]

Jamie suggested a battery with a lower Sp Gr for hot conditions, he suggested 
1240 instead of 1265. HOw would one get a 1240 battery?  If a person boght a dry 
charged battery and diluted the acid to 1240 before adding it to the cell is 
thisi the recomended method? or must a one order a 1240 battery form the 
Factory? 
Darryl



________________________________
From: Roy Butler <roy at four-winds-energy.com>
To: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>
Sent: Fri, April 22, 2011 2:48:53 PM
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Air conditioning for batteries in high temperature 
climate

Hugh,

Correct to a point. But if we added 10% capacity, we would need to add a bit 
more
charging capacity (PV/wind) and it begins to spiral up in cost. Much as I hated 
to see
that AC unit there, it was still the more cost-effective solution for that 
specific system.

FYI- with the AC unit, we also eliminated a heat issue that we'd been dealing 
with on the 

upper Outback inverters on his dual quad stack setup. Yes, we had active 
ventilation, 4 levels 

to be exact but the fans themselves became part of the problem with the 
increased power 

consumption.

So bottom line, because we killed 2 birds with one AC unit, I think it was a 
good move.
And I've worked (successfully) to avoid ever having to use one again. I really 
do prefer simple,
passive methods for solving problems like these.

Roy Butler NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer® NYSERDA eligible PV & wind 
installer PA Sunshine Program Approved PV Installer Four Winds Renewable Energy, 
LLC 8902 Route 46 Arkport, NY 14807 607-324-9747  www.four-winds-energy.com  
Although no trees were killed in the sending of this message,  a large number of 
electrons were terribly inconvenienced.                   

On 4/22/2011 3:13 PM, Hugh wrote: 
Hi Roy,
>
>
>Hi temperatures will hit the battery capacity but will the battery efficiency be 
>that much affected?  If the battery capacity is inadequate then you need to 
>compare the aircon running cost to the cost of buying a 10% larger battery.  
>Don't you?
>
>
>Cheers
>
>
>Hugh
>
>
>
>
>Bob is correct, I do have an off grid client that uses an AC unit to keep the 
>batteries cool.
>>Although we're not in a high temp climate, it does get into the 80's and low 
>>90's here
>>in the summer.
>>
>>By my calculations, he was losing an 'average' of 10% storage capacity during 
>>the 5 month
>>period from late spring to early fall. In July and August it was closer to 18%, 
>>but for calculation
>>purposes, 10% is close enough. His bank capacity is 4800AH @ 48 VDC. That's 
>>230,400 watt hours
>>and 10% of that rounds out to 23,000 watt hours lost to heat.
>>
>>I showed up one day to check something in the power shed and was dismayed to see 
>>a window
>>AC unit installed there. An interesting customer discussion ensued and I had to 
>>admit he was
>>correct in his calculations.
>>
>>The Energy Star rated AC unit consumes no more than 3,000 watt hours per day, 
>>even in the
>>highest heat. Essentially, he's 'spending" 3 kilowatt hours to 'buy back' 20 
>>kilowatt hours of
>>storage. He got me on that one!
>>
>>That reasoning didn't work on the 6 other AC units that appeared on his house 
>>the following
>>week. But that's another story altogether!
Roy Butler
>NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer®
>NYSERDA eligible PV & wind installer
>PA Sunshine Program Approved PV Installer
>Four Winds Renewable Energy, LLC
>8902 Route 46
>Arkport, NY 14807
>607-324-9747
>
>www.four-winds-energy.com
>
>Although no trees were killed in the sending of this message,
>a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.
>
>               

>On 4/22/2011 7:40 AM, bob ellison wrote:
>
>I believe Roy has a customer with a huge battery bank that air conditioned the 
>battery room. He ran the numbers and the air conditioning actually made sense.
>>
 
>
Bob Ellison
>
 
>
From: 
re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org[mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org]On
 Behalf Of R Ray Walters
>Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 4:50 PM
>To: RE-wrenches
>Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Air conditioning for batteies in high temperature 
>climate
>
 
>
Are you using temperature compensation? It lowers the voltage when its hot.
>
Also, have you considered setting the batteries in a below ground vault? I've 
had good luck with in floor battery boxes.
>
Finally, AGMs and L16s just don't last very long anyway. AGMs maybe 3 years, and 
L16s I've seen die in under 5 years and we get to 15 below zero.
>
My suggestion: temp comp, ground vault, HUP or equivalent cycle life.
>
 
>
R. Walters
>
ray at solarray.com
>
Solar Engineer
>
 
>
 
>

>
>
 
>
On Apr 21, 2011, at 1:22 PM, Starlight Solar, Larry Crutcher wrote:
>

>
>
Hello Battery Wrenches,
>
 
>
Over the years I have had several battery banks in Baja and Sonora Mexico fail 
in just 36 to 48 months. These have been L16 or 8D AGM or flooded banks, 24 and 
48 volt systems. The charging systems are working properly and 
programmed to manufacturer recommended set points and discharges are rarely over 
30% DoD.  Some batteries are only used on weekends, some are discharged daily.  
I believe what is affecting the short life is the high temperature they live in 
for 5 months each year. Temps. can hit 115 F in vented battery rooms. I have 
been thinking about a small air conditioner and insulated battery box to keep 
the battery at no more than 80 F. There are some portable units that draw about 
600 watts and the run time would be very little with a highly insulated 
enclosure. There is ample power to do this on the home I am changing batteries 
in now. Has anyone done this and gained longer battery life?
>
 
>
Best Regards,

>
Larry Crutcher
>Starlight Solar Power Systems
>
>powered by STARLIGHT
>
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--  
Hugh Piggott

Scoraig
http://www.scoraigwind.co.uk
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