[RE-wrenches] The Demise of the Rooftop Solar Tech

Bill Brooks billbrooks7 at yahoo.com
Mon Sep 13 23:07:29 PDT 2010


Andrew,

 

You make a decent argument, but it is flawed. A tech working on a faulted
array removing modules without disabling them is likely to be injured
whether or not there is a lug or a clip. The circuit must be disabled before
taking loose anything. Not an easy task, but necessary. The argument that we
need ground wires on everything because technicians are less likely to be
hurt with a faulted array misses the point. The array frames need to be
grounded so the fault current will flow to activate the ground fault
protection. Once it has done its job, it is up to the technician to think
the process through and not kill themselves.

 

Bill.

 

 

From: re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Andrew
Truitt
Sent: Monday, September 13, 2010 10:32 PM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] The Demise of WEEB

 



2 points:

1) For the sake of clarity: there are WEEB LUGS
<http://www.we-llc.com/Datasheets/204-0404-000003.pdf>  and WEEB CLIPS
<http://www.we-llc.com/Datasheets/204-0404-000007.pdf> .  WEEB Lugs are
comprised of very robust tin-plated copper lugs, stainless steel hardware,
and the actual WEEB, which is the stainless steel nippled "washer" that
pierces aluminum anodization.  WEEB Clips are simply stainless steal nippled
washers that are installed between module and rail that form a bond,
theoretically eliminating the need to bond the module to a ground wire, so
long as the rails are properly grounded.

2) My biggest concern with the WEEB Clip is that the moment a top-clamp is
loosened the module is no longer grounded!!!  To me that is not a good
grounding method.  Mr Wiley is obviously a talented inventor and he makes a
strong argument for the quality of the bond that the WEEB Clip provides when
the clip is installed properly and all mounting hardware is properly
torqued.  What I don't understand is the argument that this is as safe of a
product as a properly installed outdoor rated lug for the service tech who
has to work on that array.  


A tin-plated copper lug with a stainless steel set screw will last.  A
service tech working on a faulted array that was grounded with WEEB Clips
might not.



Andrew Truitt
Free agent
Golden, CO.




On Mon, Sep 13, 2010 at 10:04 PM, benn kilburn <benn at daystarsolar.ca> wrote:

Hopefully any crew installing PV, and familiar with this debate (which they
should be) can easily distinguish between the GBL-4 and the GBL-4DBT.  The
weight difference is quite noticeable.  If it feels light for its size, it's
aluminum, dont use it!!!  If it has some distinct weight to it, then it's
most likely the copper DBT, giv'er!

 

So what other non-conductive materials are out there that could help resolve
this frame bonding issue?

  Sunteck's BIPV SolarBlend module uses a polycarbonate frame which requires
no bonding.  Do any of you have any experiences with these? How were they to
handle, install?  Do they offer any hope or support for non-metallic module
frames?


benn
DayStar Renewable Energy Inc. 

benn at daystarsolar.ca

780-906-7807 

HAVE A SUNNY DAY

  _____  

From: ray at solarray.com
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 2010 11:14:36 -0600
To: re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org


Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] The Demise of WEEB

I didn't do the original  install, and I couldn't ID the lug because of the
corrosion.

I believe everyone is correct that this isn't the DBT rated lug, though.

Another reason to use the WEEB:  a crew can't accidentally install the wrong
(but almost identical, when new) lug. 

I'm sure the non-DBT lugs got mixed together in a bin at some point. 

 

R. Walters

ray at solarray.com

Solar Engineer

 

 

 

 

On Sep 12, 2010, at 5:41 PM, Jamie Johnson wrote:

 


 That looks like a tin plated aluminum lug (aluminum corrosion) with a
plated steel screw (rusted screw).......

 

Here is an explanation of the differences between both ILSCO GBL 4 lugs from
John Wiles Code Corner in Homepower issue 102

 

"The Ilsco GBL-4DBT is a lay-in lug 

made of solid copper, which is then tin-plated. It has a

stainless steel screw to hold the wire. The lug accepts a #14

(2 mm2) to #4 (21 mm2) copper conductor. It is listed for

direct burial (DB) and outdoor use and can be attached to

aluminum structures (the tin plate). The much cheaper Ilsco

GBL-4 lug looks identical, but is tin-plated aluminum, has

a plated screw, and is not listed for outdoor use."

 

Jamie Johnson

NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer #031310-118

General Manager

SOLAR POWER ELECTRIC

EC13001765

 

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] The Demise of WEEB
From: "Peter Parrish" <peter.parrish at calsolareng.com>
Date: Sun, September 12, 2010 6:50 pm
To: "'RE-wrenches'" <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>

Are you sure that's a ILSCO GBL-4DBT lug? I am pretty sure the set screw is
not SS, which it should be to be the genuine part.

- Peter


Peter T. Parrish, Ph.D., President
California Solar Engineering, Inc.
820 Cynthia Ave., Los Angeles, CA 90065
CA Lic. 854779, NABCEP Cert. 031806-26
peter.parrish at calsolareng.com 
Ph 323-258-8883, Mobile 323-839-6108, Fax 323-258-8885



-----Original Message-----
From: re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of R Ray
Walters
Sent: Sunday, September 12, 2010 3:10 PM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] The Demise of WEEB

A picture is worth a thousand words, (hopefully this will upload)
Here's a traditional Ilsco Lug after less than 5 years near the ocean:


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