[RE-wrenches] Charging with Outback

Tue Mar 3 16:50:11 PST 2009

William and Dan, 

Unfortunately, the sophistication of the older MX60 controllers and its
integration into the OutBack communication network was limited - there
was always an issue with the amount of code space available.   This has
been addressed with the new FLEXmax 60 and 80 amp controllers however by
using a much larger, more powerful chip and much better written
software.  This also allowed expansion of the data logging and some
additional new features as well.    

The current OutBack control network is very sophisticated - particularly
when the FNDC system monitor is included - it allows true amp-hour based
recharging as well as "return amps" type control (i.e. charge until the
actual current going into the battery tapers off while the voltage is
held up at a specific voltage level).  The data logging built into the
FLEXmax controller lets you easily see how much time was spent absorbing
and floating each day as well - which is very handy...  The FLEXmax
controller also responds to the "global" commands of the MATE to Float,
Bulk and EQ.  

The MX60s had several software revisions (too many perhaps) - and most
did not respond to the global BULK and EQ commands which were added
later.  Some of the early software revisions also did use the amount of
time that it took to reach the ABSORB voltage level to decide how long
to hold it there - but that was not ideal and it was changed early on.
It was a problem with sulfated batteries which is why we got rid of that
idea.  

If you provide our Tech Support guys and gals with the software revision
of the MX60 and the MATE we can discuss the specifics of what your
combination included.  We also can upgrade the older MX60 controllers
with the newer software - although its not possible to put the full
FLEXmax software into an older MX60 unfortunately.  Software upgrades on
the MX60 controller vary with the age - but are inexpensive - and
software upgrades of the MATE are free - we also pay for the return
shipping to make it easier.  Please call first to get an RMA number
though to make it happen fast.  

Getting the PV array to contribute to the equalization when a generator
is charging has always been tricky - this is usually caused by the
battery not requiring much current from either source - so one tends to
dominate.  The question usually is "why are you running the generator if
the PV array can do the equalization in the first place?"  Its better to
turn off the generator and let the PV alone do the EQ - the contribution
of the PV array really doesn't cause a lightly loaded generator to use
less fuel while equalizing... 

Let me know if you need any more detail on any of this or if you have
ideas or problems you want to discuss.  

Christopher

Christopher Freitas

Director of Research and Development 

OutBack Power Systems, Inc.

cfreitas at outbackpower.com <mailto:cfreitas at outbackpower.com> 

Tel 360 435 6030

Cell 360 202 4239

19009 62nd Ave NE 

Arlington WA 98223 USA

www.outbackpower.com <http://www.outbackpower.com/> 

________________________________

From: re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of
danrice at scinternet.net
Sent: Tuesday, March 03, 2009 3:48 PM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Charging with Outback

William,

I'll let others speak to the global EQ issue. I'm a bit underwhelmed by
the degree of "intelligence" in networked OB systems.

The MX CC's use "time to Bulk Voltage" to determine absorption time.
Here's what I think is happening: If you initiate a bulk charge mid day
with already close-to-full batteries, the voltage will rise to bulk set
point quickly. The MX is default set to only Absorb for as long as it
took it to get voltage up to bulk. (This can exacerbate undercharging on
sulfated batteries, too). The solution is to go into the advanced menu
and set a minimum absorption time appropriate to the battery size, array
size, and typical charging conditions. Surrette recommends at least 1
hour on larger battery banks, to avoid short absorption times on MX's.
Slightly higher risk of electrolyte consumption, though, especially on
systems sitting unused. 

-Dan Rice
Abundant Sun, LLC.

--- william at millersolar.com wrote:

From: William Miller <william at millersolar.com>
To: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Charging with Outback
Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 08:55:33 -0800

Friends:

We have been noticing that when equalizing generator fed VFX systems
with MX60 charge controllers, even though we initiate a global EQ
command, the MX60s stop EQing in short order.  I was told by Outback
this is normal.  This does not seem right to me.

Also, we seem unable to force a bulk cycle with the MX60s on a sunny
day, no generator.  They go into bulk and then drop out in a matter of
minutes.

Have any of you experienced this anomalous behavior?  Have you found any
solutions?

Thanks in advance.

William Miller

Please note new e-mail address and domain:

William Miller 
Miller Solar
Voice :805-438-5600     Fax: 805-438-4607       
email: william at millersolar.com
http://millersolar.com
<http://millersolar.com/> License No. C-10-773985
_ 

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