[RE-wrenches] XW6048 parts problem

William Miller william at millersolar.com
Mon Sep 21 10:50:36 PDT 2009


Friends:

This is really interesting.  I have had many problems technical, managerial 
and in terms of reliability with Fronius.  Others claim stellar 
performance.  I have installed 3 XW systems and they are all working very 
well, yet many of you have had what appears to be major problems with the 
XW.  I have no problem reaching Xantrex tech support using the new number 
and I get good advice.

(I did have one problem that I thought was due to XW based problems, but it 
turned out to be a balky generator.)

I will say that the 3 XW system is not ready for prime time due to space 
limitations in the PDP, but there are work arounds (contact me off 
list).  When I needed Xantrex to assist me with the AHJ, Mark Edmunds of 
Xantrex was prompt and helpful in this regard.

Go figure...

William Miller


At 07:46 PM 9/20/2009, toddcory at finestplanet.com wrote:
>After swearing off brand X I did a XW system this last spring. The 
>customer needed two AC inputs and unfortunately the GVFX topology still 
>only has one. On the single occasion I called Xantrex to ask how to raise 
>the sell (grid support) voltage the "tech support" person told me to do 
>what I already had done and hadn't worked. When I asked for other 
>suggestions he said he had none. The issue is still unresolved. I was 
>unimpressed and expect far better from tech support then this.
>
>Todd
>
>
>
>On Sunday, September 20, 2009 5:09pm, "Drake Chamberlin" 
><drake.chamberlin at redwoodalliance.org> said:
>
>Hi Peter,
>
>Do you need the extra fan?  The VFX has an internal fan.  Are there a lot 
>of heavy loads that push the limits of the Outback?  If not, take out the 
>fan or swap it for a cover with no fan.  Many VFX inverters didn't come 
>with cover fans.  I don't know if they are standard now, or not.
>
>Or, have the fan go on whenever the direct grid tie inverter is being 
>called on to charge batteries instead of feed the grid.  If loads are not 
>real heavy, battery charging, by back feeding the AC Out, may be the time 
>when the fan is needed the most.
>
>Before inverters started controlling generators, we used a device called 
>the Simple Switch, which was a voltage controlled contact.  (We'd use it 
>with a GenWiz).  I'm not sure what is out there these days. You could use 
>the Atkinson GSCM, generator start module, which senses the voltage. If 
>you need this solution, I'd call AEE.
>
>Thanks for the heads up on the Xantrex.  I just heard another horror story 
>about the Xantrex 6024 system.  According to the installer, the owner shut 
>off an AC switch and the array cooked a bank of Surrette 25CS 25 PS 
>batteries.  I don't know the new Xantrex line and don't understand how 
>this could happen.  Is this really possible?
>
>-Drake
>
>At 06:43 PM 9/20/2009, you wrote:
>>Hi Drake (and everyone else interested in this thread),
>>
>>Armed with the information from my esteemed colleagues, we went ahead and 
>>purchased a SunWise “Solar Ready-Grid Tie Battery System”, a SRB3.6 
>>to be exact. The heart of the system is a GVFX3648. I ordered it without 
>>the Charge controller and purchased a SB3000 and 3150 Wdc of PV to go with it.
>>
>>I also purchased a Grainger 2P2T relay with a 12 V coil in a NC 
>>configuration (to disconnect the SB when the batteries are fully charged 
>>in off-grid mode) and an Outback PSX-240 to transform the 240 Vac to 120 
>>Vac (in order to interface with the GVFX3648.
>>
>>When we looked into hooking the relay up to the AUX-OUT of the GVFX3648, 
>>we discovered that it was already dedicated to the fan

>>
>>So it looks like we will need to put somethiing together to sense the 
>>battery voltage and energize the relay coil, when we exceed the 
>>threshold. Any recommendations for a add-on HVD? And exactly what 
>>threshold voltage should we use for 8ea 6V 305 Ah (C/24) AGM batteries?
>>
>>And for Drake: I gravitated away from Xantrex because of a very 
>>unsatisfactory experience with a XW6048. The system failed to work 
>>properly and Xantrex “hemmed and hawed” for over six months. Bottom 
>>line: we made six service calls, two firmware upgrades and probably two 
>>dozen calls to largely clueless group tech supporters. Through it all, I 
>>lost the customer’s confidence and he chose another integrator to do a 
>>follow on commercial project. The last part of course was the worst part 
>>of the experience.
>>
>>- Peter
>>
>>Hi Peter,
>>
>>The Outback inverter will not regulate battery charge while AC 
>>coupled.  The SMA is the only system designed to give a regulated charge 
>>to batteries in the AC coupled mode. The Outback auxiliary relay can be 
>>used to drive a relay that will disconnect the input to the inverter, to 
>>regulate battery charge when grid is down.  I like an "Ice Cube Rely" 
>>(such as Idec) to control a contactor.  The coil of the Idec uses very 
>>little power.
>>
>>Why did you gravitate toward Xantrex from Outback?
>>
>>Drake
>>
>>
>>
>>At 09:25 PM 8/4/2009, you wrote:
>>
>>I would like to start a thread on AC-coupled grid tied battery backup 
>>systems. We do a fair number of GTBBSs (four to five a year) and I have 
>>gravitated from the Outback solution to the Xantrex XW solution. I am not 
>>happy with the XW product and especially not happy with Xantrexs post 
>>sales technical support. I know I have more to learn about these puppies 
>>in general, so I am genuinely disappointed with the uneven TS from Xantrex.
>>
>>I also had this nagging feeling that the heart of a GTBBS should be the 
>>tried and true high voltage inverter. Enter the SunPower positive ground 
>>requirement, and now an AC coupled system seems the best solution.
>>
>> >From the white paper that Outback sent me, there was no mention of a 
>> heavy duty relay. Doesnt the Outback inverter regulate the battery 
>> charge control?
>>
>>Has anyone tried to order a SunWize Solar Ready Battery Assemblywithout 
>>the charge controller (e.g. P/N SRB3.6). It would seem that this is a 
>>nice package for small energy needs (13 to 26 kWh of battery backup).
>>
>>- Peter
>>[]
>>  Peter T. Parrish, Ph.D., President
>>California Solar Engineering, Inc.
>>820 Cynthia Ave., Los Angeles, CA 90065
>>CA Lic. 854779, NABCEP Cert. 031806-26
>><mailto:peter.parrish at calsolareng.com>peter.parrish at calsolareng.com
>>Ph 323-258-8883, Mobile 323-839-6108, Fax 
>>323-258-8885 
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>----------
>>From: re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org [ 
>>mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of William Miller
>>Sent: Tuesday, August 04, 2009 5:55 PM
>>To: jryago at netscape.com; RE-wrenches
>>Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] XW6048 parts problem
>>
>>Jeff:
>>
>>I have a spare.  They are not kept in the socket but are loose in a 
>>bag.  Send me your mailing address off list.  I leave tomorrow for a 
>>week, so I hope I see your address before I go.
>>
>>William
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>At 04:59 PM 8/4/2009, you wrote:
>>
>>Just completed a large residential grid/gen/solar/battery system using a 
>>XW6048 inverter.
>>
>>We are using a SunnyBoy inverter at the array and doing an AC coupled 
>>backfeed.  To do this we have installed a heavy duty relay in the output 
>>of the SunnyBoy, and are using the aux. relay contacts on the XW unit to 
>>close this relay when battery voltage is at high limit (during no load 
>>power outage to prevent over-charging)
>>
>>Not sure if we lost it during installation, if it shook loose in shipment 
>>and fell out, or was missing to begin with, but to connect to the aux. 
>>contacts in th XW requires a very small green flat 5-pin connector which 
>>is missing.
>>
>>I contacted multiple people at Xantrex and their service center, waded 
>>through their web site, and finally talked to a service tech.  He advised 
>>that "he was looking for an extra one of these connectors 6 months ago 
>>and still has not received it, as these compoments are made and assembled 
>>in China and they do not stock anything that is considered an assembly 
>>part used in China to build their units."
>>
>>First, I did not realize these inverters were being assembled in China, 
>>and second, who ever heard of not stocking a replacement part just 
>>because its made in China.  If that were true, 95% of everything sold 
>>today in US would not be able to order replacement parts.
>>
>>Anybody out their know if there is a Radio Shack type supplier where I 
>>can order a bag of these and get on with the system startup and my life?
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Jeff Yago
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