Missing Junction boxes on modules[RE-wrenches]

Daryl DeJoy penobscotsolar at midmaine.com
Sat Aug 18 07:07:43 PDT 2007


    I have found it frustrating to see this trend as well. The
installations we always did with NMLT were always not only safe but
aesthetically much more pleasing to the eye than what is currently
passing for a good installation. We have been using the panel clips
AEE and a few others sell and they are superior to ties, but still
nowhere as safe as the contained, straightforward approach which seems
to be going the way of the Stegosaurus.
    I do understand the ease and simplicity of the MC stuff, but honestly,
that is not what our industry should be about.
    I second William's concern and do think there should be panels
available for those of us who care to do things this way.

Daryl DeJoy
Penobscot Solar Design
NABCEP Certified PV installer







> Yes, Jeff, we are having this problem.  We knew it was coming, however,
> and
> you must have missed me bitching about it on this forum.  Hopefully this
> means I have not been overbearing on the subject.
>
> Shell and then Solarworld had been offering the large frame modules with
> the pigtails, but they were removable.  We removed hundreds of them and
> threw them in a big old rusty battery box out back.  We substituted NMLT
> conduit for a much more reliable installation.  Using NMLT conduit is not
> expensive or time consuming:  connectors are about a buck each (less than
> a
> the cost of an MC "gen 2" connector) and we developed a technique for
> installing NMLT connectors with a cordless drill.  Time to install one
> connector:  3 seconds.
>
> Just last week we received our first order of Solarworld SW175s with the
> loose wires that can not be removed or conduit installed .  They are for a
> ground mount, so we are particularly concerned about having loose wires
> underneath the modules (the ties won't last).  The clients have
> grandchildren who will regard the ground mount racks as a jungle gym.  We
> are working on a system of wire tray that will encapsulate the leads in a
> manner that will be "untouchable."  We hope to apply for a patent in the
> near future so we will have a product available for the industry before
> someone gets killed.    So what if the ends are touch safe, rub one
> against
> an aluminum rail or rack frame or tile or comp shingles a few dozens times
> and you'll see copper.
>
> It is my impression that most of the installers out there don't give a
> crap
> if kids are swinging from 600 V wires, they just want to get the job done
> faster for more profit.  This problem is symptomatic of an industry wide
> trend.  The industry is changing, and not for the better.  There are more
> large corporate style vendors and installers out there who can afford to
> underbid us locals.  I call it the Walmart-ization of the industry.  The
> turnover in their crews is constant.  The work is shoddy and the sales
> practices are unethical.  We went to a competitor's sales seminar and the
> lies and half truths told were disgusting.  Did you know the California
> rebates are ending next week?  (They're not.).  The local chapter of the
> Sierra Club stood up and endorsed them!!!  This is way out of line for an
> environmental group to favor one vendor over another (likely because the
> local president got her installation done by them, maybe at a discount).
>
> Another thing:  to tool up for the inferior wiring system (MC) will cost
> us
> $2,000 and the delivery date is more than a month out.  So once we figure
> out how to protect our ground mount wires, we get to wait for 30 to 60
> days
> before we can hook them up.
>
> Anyway, back to the unprotected wiring:  I know many are comfortable with
> the status quo and may not want to read this, but I'd hoped that enough of
> us share this concern that we could put maybe put together a petition and
> maybe an educational web site and maybe speak out at a few
> meetings.  Anyone else out there worried about safety???
>
> William Miller
>
>
> At 11:19 AM 8/16/2007, you wrote:
>
>>So what happened to the conduit ready junction boxes on the back of the
>>modules?  Yes, pigtails are really easy to inter-connect, but we just
>>designed a 20 kW grid tie system going on a new University Science
>>building and the desigh review commettee had ruled there "will be no
>>wiring allowed that is not in conduit".
>>
>>Although most of our work now uses "plug and play" pigtails, I thought we
>>could still get these higher wattage modules with junction boxes as an
>>option  - -  Wrong!     Every supplier we have contacted for modules in
>>the 165 to 200 watt range no longer offer any junction box, or at least
>>not one that you can run 1/2" flex into.
>>
>>Due to roof layout requirements, a 175 watt module allows the best
>>physical layout for this project.  Anyone else having this problem?
>>
>>Jeff Yago
>>Dunimis Technology Inc.
>>Virginia
>
>
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