Locking Connectors [RE-wrenches]

Joel Davidson joel.davidson at sbcglobal.net
Sat Mar 3 10:11:31 PST 2007


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Hello Mark,

The NEC does not define "hard usage" or "hard service" used to describe 
certain cords. UL engineers generally consider roofs hard service areas. 
Local inspectors opinions vary about roof wiring. Some AWJs allow PVC 
conduit and some require threaded conduit because they have seen metal 
conduit compression fittings knocked open by people tripping over EMT. Some 
require conduit mounted on 4-inch blocks; some allow 1.5-inch blocks (a 2x4 
on its side). Most of us have seen temporary cables laid across roofs and 
all of us have seen phone and tv wires laid on roofs. In Europe 
double-insulated cable (we call it wire) is considered as safe as 
double-insulated power cords and is used without conduit on PV systems up to 
1000 volts. In Germany and France, wiring in public areas may or may not 
have conduit. (Some public wiring I've seen would freak-out U.S. inspectors 
and the wires would be easily stolen by sleazebags.) It will be many years 
before U.S. and European wiring methods are harmonized. In the meantime, we 
must continue to pioneer better, faster, cheaper - and safer - ways to 
install PV systems. Onward into the fog.

Joel Davidson, Future shockwave rider

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mark Frye" <markf at berkeleysolar.com>
To: <RE-wrenches at topica.com>
Sent: Friday, March 02, 2007 7:02 PM
Subject: RE: Locking Connectors [RE-wrenches]


>
> I have seen one installation like that here in the City of Berkeley. I
> really don't understand how they got it past the inspector.  It looks 
> cool,
> because they stick a bit of conduit up thru the roof and put a little
> weatherhead on it.
>
> I don't think there is anyway this is allowed by the Code.  Flexible cords
> don't require protection from mechanical damage, but flexible cords are 
> not
> allowed as a permanent wire method in structures. I don't think there is 
> any
> other product that is allowed to simply be laid out in the open on top of
> the roof.
>
> MPF
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Joel Davidson [mailto:joel.davidson at sbcglobal.net]
> Sent: Friday, March 02, 2007 6:37 PM
> To: RE-wrenches at topica.com
> Subject: Re: Locking Connectors [RE-wrenches]
>
>
>
> After module quick-connects replace j-boxes, the next step is
> double-insulated wire. In Germany and other European countries installers
> just lay the homerun wires (cables) on the roof. No conduit. No standoffs.
> No ground wire. At first, it is unnerving to see loose wires and no 
> conduit,
> but over 800 MW a year are installed this way in Germany.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Brian Teitelbaum" <brian at aeesolar.com>
> To: <RE-wrenches at topica.com>
> Sent: Friday, March 02, 2007 4:15 PM
> Subject: RE: Locking Connectors [RE-wrenches]
>
>
>>
>> Ray,
>>
>> Sorry to rain on your parade, but I hear that Solarworld is about to
>> change
>> the dimensions of the SQ175 module (now SW 175 mono) to conform with 
>> their
>> European product. I don't have the new dimensions yet though.
>>
>> Unfortunately (in my opinion) they are also going to a sealed JB with
>> either
>> the Tyco or MC locking connector. The one that I just saw at Electric 
>> West
>> had the MC locking connector on it and I was told that that module was 
>> the
>> "final" version. We shall see...
>>
>> Looks like openable JB's on modules are going by-by, at least for modules
>> over 130W. I think that this is unfortunate since I don't like the idea 
>> of
>> having open wiring on ground and pole mounts. As a compromise, I would
>> love
>> to see some way to connect liquid-tight conduit directly to the outside 
>> of
>> the JB, even if the JB is not openable. The conduit would act as a sleeve
>> over the pigtail just for physical protection. It might have to be 3/4"
>> though, because of the size of the locking plug.
>>
>> Brian Teitelbaum
>> AEE Solar
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Ray Walters [mailto:walters at taosnet.com]
>> Sent: Friday, March 02, 2007 3:13 PM
>> To: RE-wrenches at topica.com
>> Subject: Re: Locking Connectors [RE-wrenches]
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm still a huge Shell/ Solarworld Fan for all John's reasons, and they
>> don't screw around with the module dimensions every few years like BP
>> either. Today's SQ175 will fit on a rack without drilling with an old
>> 130 from 5 years ago. I just hope they don't go the MC only route. I
>> NEVER trusted MC connectors; wasn't there a recent recall of many of
>> BP's MC- only modules, because they could overheat and burn out where
>> the cable connected to the module back?
>>
>> Ray
>>
>> John Raynes wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I think y'all are convincing me to bite the bullet and stick with
>>> j-box panels, and just deal with the more difficult sourcing issues.
>>> At least until all of this settles out.  The "special tooling" for
>>> j-boxes costs about $15-20 max and it works on all types, now and into
>>> the future.  And the end result looks so much cleaner on poletop and
>>> ground mount racks, which as an off-gridder is most of what we do.
>>>
>>> John Raynes
>>>
>>>
>>> At 11:18 AM 3/2/2007 -0800, you wrote:
>>>
>>>> For better or worse, the Multi-Contact monopoly is over. Tyco
>>>> International and Multi-Contact and others think their patented and
>>>> patent pending connectors are the best and will not agree on a
>>>> standard. It's the same with no standard for modules and mounts (and
>>>> don't even bother to ask me to loan you spare tire if you get a flat).
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Maynard, Energy Outfitters"
>>>> <bob at energyoutfitters.com>
>>>> To: <RE-wrenches at topica.com>
>>>> Sent: Friday, March 02, 2007 10:43 AM
>>>> Subject: RE: Locking Connectors [RE-wrenches]
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> John,
>>>>>
>>>>> It is really going to complicate things! We've not made a decision
>>>>> if we
>>>>> will gear up for one or all types!  It will take an industry wide
>>>>> effort
>>>>> to get to a standardized connector and you can guess what will
>>>>> happen if
>>>>> we get there.  With no competition, the winning manufacturer can 
>>>>> charge
>>>>> whatever they want for their connectors!
>>>>>
>>>>> Best Regards,
>>>>> Bob Maynard
>>>>> groSolar!
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: John Raynes [mailto:john at raynes.com]
>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 01, 2007 4:52 PM
>>>>> To: RE-wrenches at topica.com
>>>>> Subject: RE: Locking Connectors [RE-wrenches]
>>>>>
>>
>>
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