Outback generator support [WAS Advice sought for large off grid PV system; 4

Jeff Wongstrom thirstylake at interbel.net
Mon Apr 2 08:28:01 PDT 2007


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Thanks Allan, I am an Outback fan and appreciate the constructive  
criticism.

I have this issue in an Outback system that originally had a single  
VFX 3524 and 800ah battery which had no problem with tripping the  
breakers of a 6.5KW Onan full output 120VAC.  When a second inverter  
was added the generator breakers started to trip during the usual  
laundry and vacuuming routine.  The 'solution' has been to drop the  
second charger out by turning down the charge rate.  Unfortunately,  
this drops the charge rate back to less than C/10 as a single charger  
does not put out more than 70a.  We do a lot of winter generator  
charging in NW Montana and do not mind hitting the batteries with C/5.

I had thought that the charger would back off and allow the generator  
to power loads without tripping gen breakers by limiting generator  
input with AC2/GEN INPUT LIMIT.  Is this the same as 'the inverter  
won't limit the pass-through load' ?

Jeff Wongstrom
NABCEP Certified Solar Installer
Thirsty Lake Solar
406-889-5324


On Apr 1, 2007, at 11:22 PM, Allan Sindelar wrote:

>
> No, Outback doesn't have generator support, at least not yet.
>
> The lack of generator support is a real issue. Somehow I just hadn't
> realized the consequence of this, even after four years of working  
> with FX
> inverters. So I am calling attention to this now so others don't  
> make the
> same mistake.
>
> You can set the charge rate for the inverter, but you can't size the
> inverter to optimize generator charging. This is because the  
> inverter won't
> limit the pass-through load. Outback suggests about 50%  
> overcapacity beyond
> what is necessary for charging.
>
> At our elevation range, a 3kW inverter-generator will put out  
> around 18-19A
> AC continuous, which is ideally suited for charging with one  
> Outback, which
> draws 19A maximum for charging purposes. However, if charging is  
> set at this
> level, there is no headroom for additional pass-through loads.
>
> The Yamaha 3kW inverter-generator will just lug, I have learned,  
> until the
> load is reduced. But the 3kW Honda inverter-generator will trip its  
> output
> breaker, which requires manual restart of the gennie.
>
> I understand that Outback is working on this obvious shortcoming.  
> My hope is
> that it will be available as a field upgrade, at least for existing  
> non-GT
> models.
>
> For now, on the one single-FX off-grid system that has an existing 3kW
> Honda, we instructed the customer to turn off the main AC load  
> breaker when
> charging from the generator. It's a less than satisfactory  
> solution, but so
> is arbitrarily turning down the charge rate.
>
> Be forewarned, and avoid my mistake.
>
> Allan at Positive Energy
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "William Miller" <wrmiller at charter.net>
> Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2007 9:48 AM
>>
>> Outback has generator support?  That is news to me!  When did this  
>> occur?
>>
>> William Miller
>>
>>
>> At 08:53 PM 3/28/2007, you wrote:
>>
>>> Outback and xantrex can support generator power, I
>>> have a 3 phase support system that was originally to
>>> be 55kW, and I found it to be cost effective up to the
>>> 55 kW.  Also Outback, and Xantrex, and SMA have
>>> products that can generator support and inverter
>>> support.
>>>
>>> What is wrong with using transformers?
>>>
>>> Darryl
>


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