Bi-Directional Meters (Was ratcheting cyclometers) [RE-wrenches]

[Robert Warren]

Matt, 
 I don't know if they have comparable meters available in the US, but  
the last 3 years when I was with Solar Century in England, some 
utilities would install a 50Hz digital Siemens meter which was not only 
bi-directional, it also had 2 sets of dry contact pulse outputs, for 
import and export values. So I was able to wire these outputs to the 25 
pin digital input port of a Sunnyboy Control Plus and not only log 
incoming and outgoing KW/Hrs, but also access this info by modem.
 So the point is, utility companies do have a new breed of electronic 
meters available, it is more a problem of initeria and unwillingness to 
change over to something new.
Robert Warren

mlafferty at universalenergies.com wrote:
> 
> Doug P said:
> 
> > many meters, particularly older standard clockwork meters like many
> > of us have been buying rebuilt, do not register accurately when
> running
> > backwards. 
> 
> All:
> 
> For purposes of a customer monitoring of their system production,
> absolute accuracy in "backward" mode may not be critical if used for
> general reference purposes.  Even what we call "non-ratcheting"
> (non-detented in Utility speak) meters aren't necessarily accurate in
> reverse direction unless designed to be so.  When it comes to the
> revenue meter, the accuracy becomes far more important.
> 
> Not all meter indicator dials run backward even with the disc running
> backward.  We think that the "backward spinning disc" means that it
> isn't detented, and therefore is running the indicator dials backward.
> Anti-theft internal provisions in many meters built (or rebuilt to
> original specs) in the past 25-30 years actually make the dials spin
> forward!  (Think of the proverbial "turn your meter upside down two
> weeks out of every month"...) 
> 
> This is only the tip of a real iceberg of hilarious frustration... Trust
> me!  
> 
> What we all regard as basically two coils driving a little motor
> attached to a bunch of sprockets and a disc is actually far more complex
> than that.  With all the regulatory, tariff & accuracy standards,
> billing, administrative, power-theft concerns & prevention thereof, etc.
> that have to be considered & dealt with before a meter is ever even
> built, ordered, installed, read or maintained, it's a wonder they don't
> just figure it's cheaper to give us the dadgummed power for free!  
> 
> From the inside, I've seen what testing, verification, and calibration
> efforts go into putting an accurate "bi-directional" meter out there.
> It's not a joke, even though I must admit I laughed at the meter-shop
> techs in the beginning when they tried to tell me about it... Seemed
> like such a simple thing to me.  That was before I understood the "other
> stuff and history behind it".  
> 
> While I suffer heartburn over Utility unreasonableness and sometimes
> outright injustice on a daily basis, metering is the fundamental
> keystone to revenue for Utilities and they don't take it lightly.  Since
> Electric Utilities are the reason meters are made, their needs are the
> first to be met.  
> 
> Think about it... As far as the regular customer is concerned, the meter
> represents "the Electric Company" to them... In many cases, it is the
> only physical piece of equipment they see as proof.  Even if they don't
> look at it on a daily basis, they are reminded each month when the bill
> comes. 
> 
> Doug's statement about "older standard clockwork" meters isn't the whole
> story.  Without verification of the bi-directional capabilities, as
> Travis C did, only time and very regular monitoring will tell.  
> 
> Remember, just because the disc is running backward doesn't mean the
> dials are... No matter how old or new it is!   In fact, the dials may be
> going FORWARD FASTER when the home is consuming more than the PV system
> is generating!  (Re-built meters are no exception!... I recommend that
> all of us using kWH meters tell our vendors that we need true
> "bi-directional" capability.)  
> 
> You and I have no way of knowing "what's inside the meter" by looking.
> Manufacturers, Design Approach, Internal Components, etc. have changed
> very regularly over the years.  I really should write a short book on
> the experiences I've been through related to this over the past five
> years.... But not tonite.  From Customers having their power turned off
> for "theft" to Customers getting $60+ "overbillings" to Customers simply
> not receiving full credit for their excess generation.  It's not funny
> when it's a "crisis", but I really do laugh later... After the "fires"
> have been put out!
> 
> My general recommendation is to NOT run an interactive system for any
> period longer than start-up / checkout before having the meter's
> bi-directional capability verified.  Be especially adamant about this
> when connecting to a demand or time-of-use account, regardless of
> whether or not it is "old clock style"!  Stick to this advice when
> connecting to a service with a digital meter on it.
> 
> Two Cents!
> 
> Matt Lafferty
> Universal Energies Institute
> mlafferty at universalenergies.com
> (916) 422-9772
> (916) 628-7694 Cell
> (916) 914-2247 Fax
> www.universalenergies.com
> 
> 
> 



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robertwarren at mail.com

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