MX 60 for wind [RE-wrenches]

Matt Tritt solarone at charter.net
Tue Aug 3 10:34:18 PDT 2004


 

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Jeff,

I forwarded your diversion controller info to Eoltec for comments. Their
first question was "where is the rectification taking place?". What good is
a controller for a three phase AC alternator without a rectifier, or are we
missing something.

Matt T

-----Original Message-----
From: Jeff Clearwater [mailto:clrwater at earthlink.net] 
Sent: Monday, August 02, 2004 1:20 PM
To: RE-wrenches at topica.com
Subject: RE: MX 60 for wind [RE-wrenches]


 

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Hi Wrenches,

In my search for diversion controls for 
wind/solar systems (to replace the EZwire center 
for a 175 with a better alternative)  I came 
across this at
http://www.flexcharge.com/flexcharge_usa/charge_method/flexcharge_charge_met
hod.htm

Anyone have experience with flexcharge contollers?  They claim the
following.

"There has been allot of discussion over which 
charge process is better, PWM, or this method. 
To add fuel to the fire, each company making 
"ON-OFF" controllers has chosen different 
voltages to set the disconnect and reconnect 
points.  We have seen controllers using a version 
of this method where the reconnect voltage on a 
12V system was set at 12.6V @ 70°F.  On this 
system the batteries would never see more than 
80% charge, and likely much less.  The PWM type 
controllers will obviously regulate the charging 
your batteries, and with proper temperature 
compensation, heat sinks, and the correct 
Bulk-Regulate-Float (3 stage) algorithm will do a 
pretty good job of it, but why settle when you 
can get so much more in a charge regulator. 
Instead of three stages with PWM you get an 
infinitely variable charge process which will 
supply the battery with exactly what it needs and 
only when it needs it.  You get less plate 
saturation gassing, non destructive equalization 
and Zero EMI as well.  "

Is this just an attempt to have an on-off 
controller look good - an attempt to cover up the 
basic limitation of on-off controllers? 
Ironically they claim it to be an "infinitely 
variable charge process?   - doesn't full current 
pulsing cause plate weakening?  They don't say 
how long those pulses are.  Are we talking 
miliseconds or seconds or minutes?

I guess I'm revealing my lack of sophisticated 
electronics knowledge here, but when a PWM charge 
control is used in a diversion mode, does the 
current flow through the controller or is the 
controller just acting as a fast switching driver 
for a contactor or solid state FET?  Can 
contactor's handle high speed switching without 
burning out?  In which case you use a FET, but 
why can't the FET's in the conroller be used?  Is 
that what a C40 is doing in diversion mode? 
Isn't that what an Enermaxer was?

When Chris F says the MX60 in conjuction with a 
solid state relay can act as a diversion charger 
is it using a PWM routine and/or MTTP 3 stage 
charging routine?  Or is it simply a voltage 
sense for an on-off device with a fixed 
hysteresis?

Any clarity here would be appreciated.

Thanks!

Jeff


>------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design wrote:
>>  But I remember a conversation with Chris F. at EO
>>  a few years back where it seemed like the MX60
>>  could be set up in a diversion mode.  I also
>>  have 35 amps of PV to regulate too however.  I
>>  could put the PVs on a MX60 and then the wind
>>  would be covered
>
>The MX60 can be used to provide control of a diversion load - either AC 
>or DC loads can controlled.  You need to add the diversion control 
>device - either a normal relay or (preferably) a solid state relay.  
>The MX60 provides a 12vdc output signal to power the relay's coil - so 
>you don't need anything other than a typical 12 vdc coil type relay 
>even if the system is 24 or 48 vdc nominal.
>
>Solid state type relays can be switched much faster than mechanical 
>relays - so the "smoothness" of the diversion control is better (i.e. 
>the power is PWM'd). When using solid state relays you need to set the 
>on/off time delays  in the MX60's diversion system setpoints to zero. 
>Solid state relays can be ordered for either AC or DC loads and need to 
>be mounted on a heatsink.  I usually suggest the Eurotherm / 
>continental brand of solid state relays - 
>http://www.ciicontrols.com/products/svdd.htm - which will handle up to 
>100 vdc and 40 amps per device (you can have more than one controlled 
>by a MX60 for larger systems).
>
>The OutBack FX inverter can also provide a diversion output control 
>signal (it also is a 12vdc signal).  It also has an AC diversion mode 
>setting in which the diversion load is turned off if the inverter gets 
>too hot or hits its overload limits.  This was suggested by Bob-O of 
>Electron Connection as he was using the FX to dump hydro output to his 
>electric water heater and had an issue when the well pump would start, 
>causing the inverter to current limit and flicker the output 
>momentarily.  With the new AC diversion mode,  the dump load would be 
>turned off instantly when the motor started - eliminating the flicker.
>
>
>Christopher Freitas
>OutBack Power Systems, Inc.
>cfreitas @ outbackpower.com
>www.outbackpower.com
>Arlington WA USA
>Tel 360 435 6030
>
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--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jeff Clearwater
Village Power Design Associates
Sustainable Energy & Water Solutions for Home & Village
http://www.villagepower.com gosolar at villagepower.com

877-SOLARVillage
425 Nimrod St.
Nevada City, CA 95959 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`~
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