RE and Regulations, both UL and IEEE [RE-wrenches]

Wed May 1 19:40:10 PDT 2002

Yes, UL is more expensive than ETL and other testing labs.
Yes, UL does not have the expertise to do JPL Block V testing.
Yes, UL acts like god's gift to the PV industry but is really on par with
Consumer Reports and Good Housekeeping.
But UL is THE standard that has helped bring PV to mainstream America's front
door.
So make UL and utility companies and building inspectors happy and make PV a
sustainable industry (and make money).

Bill Brooks wrote:

> Richard and Christopher,
>
> While I agree that competition is good when it comes to NRTLs to keep costs
> lower for everyone, I want to point out that listing of PV products has had
> a huge beneficial impact on the PV industry. We have had over 2000 PV
> installations permitted and inspected in California and most of those
> systems would never have happened if listed equip did not exist. This is
> just the beginning of a whole new market for solar products that cannot be
> ignored. I can think of things I would like to see different at both UL and
> ETL so I am not going to get drawn into a discussion of who's good and bad.
>
> A conspiracy theory surrounding UL in cahoots with IEEE in developing a
> standard that cannot be met is utter hogwash to put it mildly. Questioning
> the IEEE standards on a state-by-state basis would have absolutely no
> benefit to the PV industry. Complaining about IEEE standards will have the
> undesirable effect of classifying our PV industry as a bunch of whiners. We
> have already achieved that status with several states and it has made
> progress more difficult rather than easier. If you want to keep PV offgrid,
> what is being suggested in the article below will help toward that end.
>
> The problem is not IEEE 929 as so many folks so fondly think, the problem is
> that the manufacturers have had a tough time making their existing products
> work with the standards. Now the problem is either that the standard sucks
> or its time to go back and do a little more homework on the inverter design
> (the latter if your stuck on which one is right). Operating connected to a
> utility system is a very difficult task, and most manufacturers don't get it
> right the first time or two. The utility grid does have some problems in
> many rural areas and our equipment shows some of those problems. However,
> most problems I have run across that was blaimed on the grid was actually an
> inverter malfunction or miscalibration. That makes it tougher to put the
> pressure on when the utility actually is at fault.
>
> The utility industry lives and dies on standards. We have IEEE 929 that
> virtually every utility that has seriously looked at it has adopted. Did
> they adopt it to squash PV--heck no. The utilities that have used standards
> to squash PV are the ones that refuse to adopt it.
>
> I can easily say without exaggeration that I have had more experience
> working with utility engineers on these issues than most other folks on this
> wrenches list, and this reactionary approach smokes my tail feathers. I will
> also be the first to admit that many utilities can and have been obstructing
> PV installations. I can also say that many of the utilities that used to
> obstruct systems, are now allowing them. What changed? a lot of education
> and pioneering groundwork by several people.
>
> Pioneering is never fun and games, its hard work. Have we arrived,
> absolutely not. We have a long way to go in developing better products that
> are easier to permit, easier to install, and easier to keep running for 25
> years. Do we quit now because its still hard--from reading responses to this
> list there is now way that represents most wrenches viewpoint.
>
> Don't wimp out at being a pioneer and succumb to the dark side of being a
> solar guerilla. Stick with being a pioneer and make PV easy for your
> children and grandchildren. Guerillas are not moving this industry forward.
> They are either hurting by being a bad example or having absolutely no
> positive impact because they don't exist in the real world.
>
> When we run into opposition, we must first ask ourselves if the opposition
> is because someone has it out for the technology, or because they don't
> understand it. Nine out of 10 folks that I run into that initially oppose
> the technology are doing it to be vindictive, but because they don't
> understand it yet. We have to market this disruptive technology effectively
> showing that it can provide so many benefits that existing utility power
> cannot. Enough said for now. (Richard if you would like to publish this as a
> counterpoint--feel free--thanks for the opportunity to vent and no hard
> feelings
>
> Bill.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Richard Perez, Home Power magazine
> [mailto:richard.perez at homepower.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2002 2:34 PM
> To: RE Wrenches
> Subject: RE and Regulations, both UL and IEEE [RE-wrenches]
>
> Hello Wrenches
>
> I want to agree with Christopher Freitas on UL being a roadblock in
> the way of RE progress. I have no bones to pick with safety and the
> necessary function of certifying gear which is safe, I just think
> that UL has become reactionary.
>
> And these sort of regulatory problems don't stop with UL. We've also
> got specs for grid-tied inverters that are bogus, essentially written
> by utilities and rubber stamped by the IEEE.
>
> Here's a preview of a short article which will appear in the
> June/July issue of Home Power. I am hoping that Wrenches will lead
> the way in getting the standards for utility intertied inverters on
> some reasonable and realistic standard.
>
> Get Organized!
>
> Utah just became the 35th state to pass a net metering law. Is our
> struggle to bring homemade renewable energy on-grid just about done?
> No such luck. As with many legal issues, the devil is in the
> details....
>
> At a recent solar business seminar held by Energy Outfitters, more
> than 35 RE dealers heard presentations by industry representatives,
> including three grid-intertie inverter manufacturers. One of the
> major grid-intertie problems discussed was the Institute of
> Electrical and Electronics Engineers (IEEE) 519 and 929 standards.
> These standards set power quality and anti-islanding requirements for
> grid-intertie inverters, and are included in most state net metering
> laws.
>
> Many dealers and manufacturers are finding that grid-intertie
> inverters jump off-grid, or even refuse to connect to the grid at
> all. When utility grids are undervoltage, overvoltage, or have too
> much distortion, inverters programmed to IEEE standards will not
> connect.
>
> This isn't a safety issue. Safety is taken care of by other
> grid-intertie inverter standards (UL 1741). This is an issue of the
> grid's power quality. What we are discovering is that in many areas,
> the grid is far too funky to allow inverter intertie. The utilities
> are holding our RE inverters to standards that they cannot maintain
> themselves!
>
> I view these IEEE standards as just another in a long series of
> roadblocks that utilities have put in the way of grid-intertied, RE.
> Having a state net metering law is irrelevant if the inverter is held
> to standards that will not allow it to connect to the grid. The
> further irony is that our grid-connected RE could help the utilities
> clean up their grid power quality problems!
>
> It's time to get organized again. The only way to effectively change
> this situation is for us, state by state, to question the IEEE
> standards. We need to go to our state PUCs and governments, and lobby
> for change. I'm sorry that our work didn't end with passing net
> metering laws. Now we have to go for the devil in the details.
>
> If you want to help, e-mail me. I'll act as an information
> clearinghouse until individual state groups get organized. We've got
> some work to do.
>
> Access
> Richard Perez, Home Power
> mailto:richard.perez at homepower.com
> http://www.homepower.com
>
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