Spread sheet on "pay back" for grid-tied PV [RE-wrenches]

Tue Mar 5 07:50:01 PST 2002

Payback?
Sure I get a 5 to 10 Years payback How do I figure?
My neighbor gets an electric bill of $ 80.00/month
I told him My bill is on average is $ 12.00/month  $ 8.00 service charge + $
4.00  
He wanted to know how did I do this. 
I told him that I make on average $ 4.00 a month from the sun and use $ 4.00
a month from the grid and the rest is conservation.
My average monthly bill = $ 12.00
 Ok I do not use Air Conditioning.
When there is a power outage I have limited power and I go on a super
conservation mode
I have a central Air Conditioner that I do not use.
I had the utility put on a device that will shut it off for a max of 3 hours
at any givin day in the summer. The give me $ 40.00 a year for letting them
do that.
So bottom Line
HIS yearly bill =  $ 80.00 x 12  =           =   $  960.00
My Yearly Bill  =  ($ 12.00 X 12) - $ 40.00  =   $  104.00  

						Savings  =   $  856.00/Year

The way I put it if you learn consevation and install a system you can save
$ 856.00/Year 
Have some power when the grid is down and help the environment.

JIM LAMB 
Middlefork Engineering

-----Original Message-----
From: Travis Creswell, Ozark Solar [mailto:ozsolar at ipa.net]
Sent: Friday, March 01, 2002 1:52 PM
To: RE-wrenches at topica.com
Subject: Re: Spread sheet on "pay back" for grid-tied PV [RE-wrenches]

Hello Bruce,

Graham is right on track.  I'm not sure where you are at but there is one
thing I know in my service area.  If a person asks about payback they will
never be a customer.  I tell everyone who calls about using solar to save
energy... "solar doesn't save energy, it produces energy.  YOU save
energy!".

That effectively, and I think respectfully, gets the point across and lets
you get back to designing and installing the best system for someone is not
worried about payback.

Similar to Graham, one of my very first questions to folks is.."are you
looking into to solar to save money".  That immediately tells me where to go
with the conversation.

Travis Creswell
Ozark Energy Services

----------
>From: graham at solarexpert.com
>To: RE-wrenches at topica.com
>Subject: RE: Spread sheet on "pay back" for grid-tied PV [RE-wrenches]
>Date: Fri, Mar 1, 2002, 11:44 AM
>

>Hi Bruce,
>
>I have tried making a spreadsheet to chart and show a monetary bottom
>line savings.  As you mentioned, nobody honestly knows what the future
>cost of energy will be.  I don't think anybody even knows how many
>decades' grid-connected inverters will last.  A spreadsheet showing a
>30-year life cycle should also show the cost to remove and replace the
>modules for re-roofing, unless the system is ground mounted.  I gave up
>on the spreadsheet.
>
>Selling solar in Los Angeles where electricity costs 11 cents a kWh is
>harder than selling a peak shaving system for Edison and PG&E customers.
> Peak shaving systems can have a relatively quick monetary payback.  The
>problem is getting permits and the inspection process can be a
>nightmare.  The CEC and LADWP are both taking several months to pay the
>rebates, this creates even more challenges.
>
>The news lately has stories about how the Governor of California is
>going to renegotiate the long term energy contracts and how that should
>reduce the cost of electricity in the near future.
>
>I get allot of calls from homeowners interested in PV.  The first thing
>I ask is "what are your goals and why are you interested in having a
>solar system installed?"  If they are only seeking a money saving device
>I have learned to not focus much time and attention to these callers.
>When a caller states that they "want to help do their part to reduce
>global warming, or have always been interested in solar power and now
>that half of it is being paid for and they want it."  These people get
>my immediate attention.  I have learned to advertise in print media
>directed to the environmental crowd, such as a local Sierra Club Chapter
>monthly newspaper.  Earth Day is coming soon and handing out business
>cards through the crowd should produce some good leads.  I think you
>need to get the phones busy with many callers then you can pick the
>customers who you feel will be happy with a PV system.
>
>Graham Owen
>
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