[RE-wrenches] Radian Glitch

Mon Jan 17 11:32:02 EST 2022

Hi Howie
Thank you for taking my phone call this morning. The charging in Mac’s system was terminated by the warm up and cool down times as programmed into the AGS.
So a gen run was called for.
The system waited for the warmup time of 1 minute before charging began.
The event logs show a Soc stop command was initiated.
The  charger was turned of and the gen ran for the 1 minute cool down time.
The gen stop was initiated after the cool down time of 1 minute.

From: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org> On Behalf Of Howie Michaelson
Sent: Sunday, January 16, 2022 11:00 AM
To: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Radian Glitch

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Lones,
Thanks for the attempted direct communication via phone - sorry I didn't catch it.
I appreciate the clarification about the system logic and what the issue seems to have been.  I am still confused as to why the system would leave the generator running after it decided it was done charging based on the settings. I understand that the SOC start/stop charging was much tighter than would typically be desirable, but I don't understand why that would create the generator "run on" after those parameters were met.
I ask in part because my experience with the original Mate on VFX systems is what appears to be a software glitch or a minor component failure, where the AGS system fails to send a signal to the generator to start based on programmed parameters.  It is odd since it seems to work sometimes and then not at other times.  The issue seems to appear after the mate is several years old, and the only way I've been able to fix the problem is to replace the mate, and then the system works fine. (Sorry to sort of hijack this thread).
Howie
Howie Michaelson
Sun Catcher
NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer™
[https://drive.google.com/uc?id=1MQF8aTcFNnBR59ia5JAm1DsPHCxzNkPx&export=download]
Solar Electric Systems Sales & Service
802-272-0004

On Fri, Jan 14, 2022 at 3:42 PM Tuss, Lones <lones.tuss at enersys.com<mailto:lones.tuss at enersys.com>> wrote:
Hello Howie
I  believe the situation was this.
The gen would automatically start ..as it should.
The inverter would accept the ac source… as it should.
It would begin a charge sequence again …as it should.
But
The inverter would shut off the generator within a very short amount of time.
Usually this is caused by a start condition initiating a gen run.
But some other stop condition causing the gen to be turned off.
With 3 different run stop conditions used in the Mate3S it was just a matter of making thing a little more simple. I disabled the SOC run/stop in the Mate3S AGS just to see if that was the cause of the stop command.
Doing a 2 minute  voltage start will cause the  gen to run until the absorb timer on the inverter has zeroed out. Indeed it did. The Soc command was set to start at 80 or 82% (I forget which) and Stop at 90% as requested by the customer.
Both Mac and I agreed this was a bit crazy but it was what the customer wanted.
By looking in the Optics Event logs the shut down was attributed to the Stop SOC condition being met.
So eliminating SOC was a logical first step.
    To me the only remaining question is I did not see the SOC reach 90% but that is a pretty tight window in which to operate. A more usual SOC start /stop  condition would be 60%to 90% with a 100% charge required every so often (user selectable). I believe this system was set for 100% charge every 14 Days.
I hope this helps explain without adding further confusion.
Take Care All

From: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org<mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org>> On Behalf Of Howie Michaelson
Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2022 2:42 PM
To: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org<mailto:re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>>
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Radian Glitch

CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the Company. Do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe.

Thanks for the update Lines. While it seems from turning off the soc gen control, the generator is running as it should, I don't understand how that explains the charging behavior, or why the inverter continued to ruin the generator without using it's output.
Howie
Howie Michaelson
Sun Catcher
NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer™
Solar Electric & Heat Pumps Systems Sales & Service
802-272-0004

On Thu, Jan 13, 2022, 1:32 PM Tuss, Lones <lones.tuss at enersys.com<mailto:lones.tuss at enersys.com>> wrote:
Hello Wrenches
I was able to contact Mac this morning. Luckily this system was on optics so we were able to go look at the start and stop conditions in the AGS programming and the Event logs.
The event logs stated the stop was caused by an SOC stop command.
In AGS this system is using 3 start conditions
Voltage start , Load start and  Soc start
At the customer’s request the Soc is set to start at 82 % and stop at 90%
Which seems a little crazy to both Mac and I
But to test if the Soc was indeed the cause of the short run.
We disabled the SOC start/stop.
We then started a bulk cycle to set the absorb timer to the 2 hr time limit as programmed in the inverter.
We raised the 2 minute timer above the current battery voltage to initiate a gen run.
The gen did start and at this point the gen has run for approximately 1.5 to 2 hours.
So it does appear that  SOC stop was the cause of the short run, as indicated in the event Log.
What neither or Mac or myself can explain is the graph on the Dashboard does not show the Soc above
80%  I am not certain if it is due to a momentary spike that is too quick to record. At this point that is just a guess (sorry). But that is the situation.
   I will say it was nice to have this on Optics as we could go visit the site and do everything from our respective homes.
Mac thank you for returning my call and working through this issue.
Take Care All

From: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org<mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org>> On Behalf Of Mac Lewis
Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2022 4:38 AM
To: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org<mailto:re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>>
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Radian Glitch

CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the Company. Do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe.

Good Morning Wrenches,

I have an Outback Radian 8048 site that is acting up.

This only happens when the generator is automatically started.
It will start the generator and warm it up normally and then connect and start charging as it should.  After about 30 seconds to 1 minute it will drop the AC input, and put the generator in cool down mode and the charger will be disabled.  It will then continue to run the generator until you turn it off manually, presumably because it hasn't reached the stop trigger.

This system will charge normally when the generator is manually started.  The firmware on the Mate3s is up to date.

Any ideas?

Thanks in advance

--

Mac Lewis

"Yo solo sé que no sé nada." -Sócrates

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