<div dir="auto"><div>Drake,<div dir="auto">I believe that is for a single phase 2 wire output only. I am assuming one hot and one neutral for the inverter output in this case. I would think most *grid tied* inverters fall under 705.95B, where the neutral is only a voltage sense and can be sized as small as the equipment ground.</div><div dir="auto">Cheers,</div><div dir="auto">Dave</div><br><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Tue, Jan 25, 2022, 8:37 AM <<a href="mailto:drake.chamberlin@redwoodalliance.org">drake.chamberlin@redwoodalliance.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,Geneva,sans-serif">
<p>"the maximum load connected between the neutral and any one <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#ungrounded" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">ungrounded</a> conductor plus the <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/6/special-equipment#inverter" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">inverter</a> output rating shall not exceed the <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#ampacity" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">ampacity</a> of the <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#neutral_conductor" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">neutral conductor</a>."</p>
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<p>So the neutral conductor is supposed to be sized for the connected load plus the entire maximum output of the inverter?</p>
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<p id="m_3695074346584270383reply-intro">On 2022-01-24 12:10, Kirk Herander wrote:</p>
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<h1 style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;font-weight:400;font-size:40px;font-family:Inter,sans-serif;line-height:2.5rem">705.95 Ampacity of Neutral Conductor</h1>
<div style="padding:0px;margin:17px 0px 0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0"><a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">National Electrical Code 2017 of New York State</a> > <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/7/special-conditions#7" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">7 Special Conditions</a> > <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/7/special-conditions#705" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">705 Interconnected Electric Power Production Sources</a> > <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/7/special-conditions#705.95" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">705.95 Ampacity of Neutral Conductor</a></div>
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<div style="padding:0px;margin:18px 0px 19px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;line-height:1.5">The <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#ampacity" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">ampacity</a> of the <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#neutral_conductor" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">neutral conductors</a> shall comply with either (A) or (B).</div>
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<h2 style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;font-size:1rem;line-height:1.75rem"><a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:inherit;outline:0px" href="#m_3695074346584270383_NOP" rel="noreferrer noreferrer">(A) Neutral Conductor for Single Phase, 2-Wire Inverter Output</a></h2>
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<div style="padding:0px;margin:18px 0px 19px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;line-height:1.5">If a single-phase, 2-<a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/8/communications-systems#wire" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">wire</a> <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/6/special-equipment#inverter" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">inverter</a> output is connected to the neutral and one <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#ungrounded" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">ungrounded</a> conductor (only) of a 3-<a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/8/communications-systems#wire" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">wire</a> system or of a 3-phase, 4-<a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/8/communications-systems#wire" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">wire</a>, wye-connected system, the maximum load connected between the neutral and any one <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#ungrounded" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">ungrounded</a> conductor plus the <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/6/special-equipment#inverter" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">inverter</a> output rating shall not exceed the <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#ampacity" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">ampacity</a> of the <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#neutral_conductor" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">neutral conductor</a>.</div>
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<h2 style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;font-size:1rem;line-height:1.75rem"><a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:inherit;outline:0px" href="#m_3695074346584270383_NOP" rel="noreferrer noreferrer">(B) Neutral Conductor for Instrumentation, Voltage, Detection or Phase Detection</a></h2>
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<div style="padding:0px;margin:18px 0px 19px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;line-height:1.5">A conductor used solely for instrumentation, <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#voltage_of_a_circuit" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">voltage</a> detection, or phase detection and connected to a single-phase or 3-phase <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#interactive_inverter" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">interactive inverter</a>, shall be permitted to be sized at less than the <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#ampacity" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">ampacity</a> of the other current-carrying conductors and shall be sized equal to or larger than the <a style="padding:0px;margin:0px;border:0px solid #e2e8f0;color:#787c81;outline:0px;text-decoration-line:none" href="https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#grounding_conductor_equipment_egc" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">equipment grounding conductor</a>.</div>
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<div dir="ltr">On Mon, Jan 24, 2022 at 11:58 AM Foxfire Energy <<a href="mailto:dan@foxfire-energy.com" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">dan@foxfire-energy.com</a>> wrote:</div>
<blockquote style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid #cccccc;padding-left:1ex">I'd start with the manufacturers recommendations<br><br>Sent from my iPhone<br><br>> On Jan 24, 2022, at 11:52 AM, jay <<a href="mailto:jay.peltz@gmail.com" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">jay.peltz@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>> <br>> HI All,<br>> <br>> Where do I find in the code how to size a sense only neutral wire for GT inverter.<br>> <br>> thanks<br>> <br>> jay<br>> <br>> peltz power<br>> <br>> <br>> _______________________________________________<br>> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance<br>> <br>> Pay optional member dues here: <a href="http://re-wrenches.org" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">http://re-wrenches.org</a><br>> <br>> List Address: <a href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a><br>> <br>> Change listserver email address & settings:<br>> <a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br>> <br>> There are two list archives for searching. When one doesn't work, try the other:<br>> <a href="https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/</a><br>> <a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br>> <br>> List rules & etiquette:<br>> <a href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a><br>> <br>> Check out or update participant bios:<br>> <a href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.members.re-wrenches.org</a><br>> <br>_______________________________________________<br>List sponsored by Redwood Alliance<br><br>Pay optional member dues here: <a href="http://re-wrenches.org" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">http://re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>List Address: <a href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>Change listserver email address & settings:<br><a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>There are two list archives for searching. When one doesn't work, try the other:<br><a href="https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/</a><br><a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>List rules & etiquette:<br><a href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a><br><br>Check out or update participant bios:<br><a href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.members.re-wrenches.org</a><br><br></blockquote>
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