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    <p>I second that.  <br>
    </p>
    <pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Ray Walters
Remote Solar
303 505-8760</pre>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 5/6/21 10:33 AM, Dave Angelini
      Offgrid Solar wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
      cite="mid:aa189c8c14b31d9265382598f3a3887e@127.0.0.1">
      <meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
      <p>I would not do any of this for an offgrid client. It is against
        the rule of less is more. The whole design is flawed in my
        opinion.</p>
      <div>
        <pre> </pre>
        <pre><strong><span style="font-size: small;">Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
<a href="http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/</a>
e-mail  <a href="mailto:offgridsolar@sti.net" moz-do-not-send="true">offgridsolar@sti.net</a>
text 209 813 0060</span></strong></pre>
      </div>
      <p>On Tue, 4 May 2021 19:24:13 -0400, Dave Tedeyan
        <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:dave@sungineersolar.com">&lt;dave@sungineersolar.com&gt;</a> wrote:</p>
      <blockquote type="cite" style="padding-left:5px;
        border-left:#1010ff 2px solid; margin-left:5px; width:100%"><!-- html ignored --><!-- head ignored --><!-- meta ignored -->
        <div dir="auto">I suppose the question here is - which is the
          worse failure mode? 
          <div dir="auto">A. Solar turning off until an electrician can
            fix it.</div>
          <div dir="auto">OR</div>
          <div dir="auto">B. Not knowing the contactor failed until it
            does not open when the generator turns on and running the
            risk that the solar backfeeds the generator and breaks it.</div>
          <div dir="auto"> </div>
          <div dir="auto">For off-grid maybe A would be more of a
            concern. But for grid tied, I would think option B would be
            worse.</div>
          <div dir="auto"> </div>
          <div dir="auto">Does anyone have a fail safe method of doing
            this?</div>
          <div dir="auto"> </div>
          <div dir="auto">Cheers,</div>
          <div dir="auto">Dave</div>
        </div>
        <br>
        <div class="gmail_quote">
          <div class="gmail_attr" dir="ltr">On Tue, May 4, 2021, 4:41 PM
            Chris Schaefer &lt;<a href="mailto:chris@solarandwindfx.com"
              moz-do-not-send="true">chris@solarandwindfx.com</a>&gt;
            wrote:</div>
          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0 0 0 .8ex;
            border-left: 1px #ccc solid; padding-left: 1ex;">
            <div dir="ltr">Jason,
              <div> </div>
              <div>A valid concern which is why I always wire them as
                powered open so if there is a failure it would
                transition closed or not open.</div>
              <div> </div>
              <div>Christopher</div>
            </div>
            <br>
            <div class="gmail_quote">
              <div class="gmail_attr" dir="ltr">On Tue, May 4, 2021 at
                4:15 PM Jason Szumlanski &lt;<a
                  href="mailto:jason@floridasolardesigngroup.com"
                  moz-do-not-send="true">jason@floridasolardesigngroup.com</a>&gt;
                wrote:</div>
              <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0px 0px 0px
                0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #cccccc; padding-left:
                1ex;">
                <div dir="auto">
                  <div>What happens when the contactor fails? I don't
                    trust a NC contactor that is supposed to open on
                    240Vac coil voltage from the generator. It's not a
                    failsafe solution. 
                    <div dir="auto"> </div>
                    <div dir="auto">Jason</div>
                    <div dir="auto"> </div>
                    <br>
                    <br>
                    <div class="gmail_quote">
                      <div class="gmail_attr" dir="ltr">On Tue, May 4,
                        2021, 3:15 PM Drake &lt;<a
                          href="mailto:drake.chamberlin@redwoodalliance.org"
                          moz-do-not-send="true">drake.chamberlin@redwoodalliance.org</a>&gt;
                        wrote:</div>
                      <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0px
                        0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #cccccc;
                        padding-left: 1ex;">
                        <div>P.S. The contactor method is even mentioned
                          somewhere in the Outback literature. I've been
                          using it for years. It is very simple and
                          requires no complex equipment. It will not
                          interfere with rapid shutdown. 40 A, 240 V
                          contactors with 240 V coils are readily
                          available and not terribly expensive. The 240
                          V output of the generator circuit provides the
                          signal. <br>
                          <br>
                          At 10:02 AM 5/4/2021, you wrote:<br>
                          <blockquote type="cite"
                            style="padding-left:5px; border-left:#1010ff
                            2px solid; margin-left:5px; width:100%">Get
                            a contactor with a 240 VAC coil. Connect the
                            coil wire wires to the 240 V output circuit
                            of the generator, so when the generator
                            comes on, the contactor opens. Run the
                            current from the AC coupled Enphase
                            inverters through the contacts from common
                            to N/C. <br>
                             <br>
                            ---<br>
                             <br>
                            <br>
                            <br>
                            On 2021-05-03 10:26, Dave Tedeyan wrote:<br>
                            <blockquote type="cite"
                              style="padding-left:5px;
                              border-left:#1010ff 2px solid;
                              margin-left:5px; width:100%">Hi All,  <br>
                              <br>
                              I am planning on using a Sol-Ark for the
                              first time for adding battery backup to an
                              existing system. It is Enphase, so clearly
                              it will be AC coupled, and there is a
                              whole house generator. When I talked to
                              Sol-Ark about it, they recommended putting
                              the generator on a time of use schedule to
                              not allow it to come on during the day so
                              that we don't run into the issue of the
                              solar backfeeding the generator.<br>
                               <br>
                              I was wondering though if anyone has just
                              used a contactor to cut out the solar when
                              the generator turns on? Something like
                              Outback's GS-AC-Gen-Kit, although in this
                              case I will need something rated for just
                              over 30A. This seems like a better way to
                              allow the generator to run at any time it
                              is needed, especially if it is a gloomy,
                              snowy, winter day.<br>
                               <br>
                              Cheers, <br>
                              Dave<br>
                               <br>
                              -- <br>
                              <strong>Dave Tedeyan, PE<br>
                              </strong> <img alt="Sungineer Solar"
                                moz-do-not-send="true" width="200"
                                height="50"> <br>
                              1653 Slaterville Road, Ithaca, NY 14850<br>
                              Cell: 607-288-2898<br>
                              <a href="http://www.sungineersolar.com/"
                                moz-do-not-send="true">www.sungineersolar.com</a><br>
                              <br>
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            <div dir="ltr">
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                      <div dir="ltr">
                        <p style="text-align: center;"><span
                            style="font-size: 10pt; color: #1f497d;"><span
                              style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif;">Chris
                              Schaefer's<br>
                            </span></span><a style="font-size: 12.8px;"
                            href="http:www.solarandwindfx.com"
                            moz-do-not-send="true"><img style="color:
                              #1f497d; font-family: Arial,sans-serif;
                              font-size: 10pt;"
                              src="cid:part36.1D4A8018.FB831CCC@solarray.com"
                              alt="" class="" width="200" height="40"></a><br>
                          <em><span style="font-family:
                              Arial,sans-serif; color: #1f497d;"><span
                                style="font-size: 9pt;">Tel/Fax
                                585-229-2083 or Cell 585-748-1870 </span><span
                                style="font-size: 12px;"><br>
                              </span></span></em><em style="font-size:
                            12.8px;"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"><span
                                style="color: #1f497d;"><span
                                  style="font-family: Arial,
                                  sans-serif;">5115 South Hill Road ~
                                  Canandaigua New York 14424<br>
                                </span></span></span></em><em
                            style="font-size: 12.8px;"><span
                              style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
                              Arial,sans-serif; color: #1f497d;"><a
                                href="http://www.solarandwindfx.com"
                                moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                                  style="color: blue;">www.solarandwindfx.com</span></a>
                              ~ E-mail: <span style="color: blue;"><a
                                  href="mailto:chris@solarandwindfx.com"
                                  moz-do-not-send="true">chris@solarandwindfx.com</a></span></span></em></p>
                        <p style="text-align: center;"><em><span
                              style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
                              Arial,sans-serif; color: #1f497d;"><img
                                src="cid:part36.1D4A8018.FB831CCC@solarray.com"
                                alt="" class="" width="200" height="56"><br>
                            </span></em></p>
                        <p style="text-align: center;"><span
                            style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
                            Arial,sans-serif; color: black;">Thomas
                            Jefferson, the author of our great
                            Constitution, once said, "democracy" will
                            cease to exist when you take away from those
                            who are willing to work and give to those
                            who would not."</span><span
                            style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
                            Arial,sans-serif; color: #1f497d;"></span></p>
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