<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
</head>
<body>
<p>I've always interpreted this rule to mean to the wiring, not to
the bottom edge of the array. 110.27 refers to live parts;
that's actual uninsulated bare conductors, lugs, or switch
contacts, etc. Further, 690.31(A) just says "circuit conductors
shall be guarded...." Finally, if the conductors are within 8 ft
of the ground, then usually you can just put a plastic shield, or
expanded aluminum lathe on the bottom of the rails to protect the
conductors.</p>
<p><img
src="https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fmillersolar.com%2FMillerSolar%2Fcase_studies%2FWire_shielding_on_ground_mounted_PV_arrays%2FFull_images%2FShielded.JPG&f=1&nofb=1"
alt="Wire Shielding ground Mount" width="713" height="534"></p>
<p>I pinched this pic from Miller Solar, one of our long time
wrenches here.</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Ray Walters
Remote Solar
303 505-8760</pre>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 7/18/20 3:57 PM, Dave Angelini
Offgrid Solar wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:fcdebc61e3c15435d644afc040ab3ba9@127.0.0.1">
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
<p>I would give a small amount of additional time to convince the
inspector. After that I would build the fence he wants. I would
also build it to be easily dismantled/removed. Good Luck!</p>
<div>
<pre> </pre>
<pre><strong><span style="font-size: small;">Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
<a href="http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/</a>
e-mail <a href="mailto:offgridsolar@sti.net" moz-do-not-send="true">offgridsolar@sti.net</a>
text 209 813 0060</span></strong></pre>
</div>
<p>On Sat, 18 Jul 2020 10:05:49 -0400, Kirk Herander
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:vtsolar@icloud.com"><vtsolar@icloud.com></a> wrote:</p>
<blockquote type="cite" style="padding-left:5px;
border-left:#1010ff 2px solid; margin-left:5px; width:100%"><!-- html ignored --><!-- head ignored --><!-- meta ignored -->
<div id="__MailbirdStyleContent" style="font-size: 12pt;
font-family: Arial; color: #000000;">Thanks all. The NEC
reference 110.27 is helpful.
<div> </div>
<div>I am in a battle now with my AHJ building inspector which
relates indirectly to the 8' rule question. I have mounted
several modules awning-style above a window at an angle of
30 degrees. The bottom of the array is 7' from grade. The
inspector insists that this is a ground-mount array, even
though it is mounted on the wall of a habitable building. He
cites NFPA 1, 2012 fire safety rules which are adopted in my
locale. In his brain, I must add a fence to insure no one
can touch the array within 10' per NFPA access guidelines
for ground-mounts.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>The NFPA does not cover wall-mounts specifically, if at
all. It only defines arrays on buildings (roof) and "real"
ground mounts, i.e. mounted on a detached structure. </div>
<div>The exposed PV wire enters a J-box roughly 10' above
grade(behind the array), more than complying with guidance
in NEC 110.27. I am using this rule as backup to my position
that NFPA fire safety rules for ground mounts do not apply,
and the wire runs are protected accordingly per the NEC. IMO
the intent of the NFPA 10' ground-mount rule is to protect
the array and specifically wiring from damage, which
compliance with NEC 110.27 already does.<br>
<div class="mb_sig"> </div>
<blockquote class="history_container"
style="border-left-style: solid; border-width: 1px;
margin-top: 20px; margin-left: 0px; padding-left: 10px;">
<p style="color: #aaaaaa; margin-top: 10px;">On 7/18/2020
4:01:34 AM, Martin Herzfeld
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:findsolar@herzfeld.org"><findsolar@herzfeld.org></a> wrote:</p>
<div style="font-family: Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;">
<div dir="auto">
<div dir="auto">Simply, the '2.5 m' (8 ft) has been
inferred from Article 110.27(A)(4). It's
interesting now that the distance in the 2019
CEC/2017 NEC has increased based on voltage. In
other words, if the voltage is greater than 301
volts the minimum would be 8 ft 6 in. :)<br>
<br>
<div dir="auto">All the best, <br>
<br>
Martin Herzfeld, Interstate Renewable Energy
Council (IREC) Certified Master Trainer \u2122 for
Photovoltaics (PV) Installation Professional #IREC
10037<br>
Contract Training Provider (CTP)<br>
Adjunct Professor, Energy<br>
<br>
California Solar & Electrical Contractor
License #00833782 C46, C10, D56, D31, C-7<br>
Solar, Electrical, Trenching, Pole Installation
& Maintenance, Instrumentation<br>
<br>
Contract Solar (PV) Technical Inspector - 3rd
Party Inspections <br>
Underwriters Laboratories (UL) Certified PV
Installer #17, OSHA 30<br>
OSHA-Authorized Construction Trainer #32-0105338<br>
CompTIA Certified Technical Classroom Trainer
(CTT+) #T3NSZCNBBKB4QTQG<br>
<br>
* Professional Member, International Association
of Electrical Inspectors #7035507 - Since 2006<br>
* Accredited and Registered North American Board
of Certified Energy Practitioners (NABCEP)
Continuing Education (CE) Training Provider </div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote" dir="auto">
<div class="gmail_attr" dir="ltr">On Fri, Jul 17,
2020, 7:32 PM August Goers <<a
href="mailto:august@luminalt.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">august@luminalt.com</a>>
wrote:</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0 0
0 .8ex; border-left: 1px #ccc solid;
padding-left: 1ex;">
<div dir="ltr">Hi Kirk - We work in San
Francisco where they have a <a
href="https://codelibrary.amlegal.com/codes/san_francisco/latest/sf_building/0-0-0-84935"
moz-do-not-send="true">local code amendment:</a>
<div dir="auto"> </div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: #212529;">300.4(I)
Add the following section:</span> </div>
<div dir="auto"> (I) Subject to Physical
Damage. Premises wiring systems installed
less than 2.44 m (8 feet) above a walking
surface or finished floor are considered
subject to physical damage.</div>
<div dir="auto"> </div>
<div dir="auto">As far as I'm aware otherwise,
there is not a specific definition
specifying 8' for physical damage in the
broader NEC - I think it's just up to the
AHJ.</div>
<div dir="auto"> </div>
<div dir="auto">August</div>
<div dir="auto">Luminalt</div>
<div dir="auto">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<p> </p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div class="gmail_attr" dir="ltr">On Fri, Jul
17, 2020 at 8:38 AM Kirk Herander <<a
href="mailto:vtsolar@icloud.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">vtsolar@icloud.com</a>>
wrote:</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:
0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid
#cccccc; padding-left: 1ex;">
<div
id="m_-852594464042037636gmail-m_-6317156316255650834__MailbirdStyleContent"
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family:
Arial; color: #000000;">All,
<div> </div>
<div>Is there a reference to this
so-called "8-foot rule" that someone
could point me to in the NEC? Thanks.</div>
</div>
_______________________________________________<br>
List sponsored by Redwood Alliance<br>
<br>
List Address: <a
href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a><br>
<br>
Change listserver email address &
settings:<br>
<a
href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br>
<br>
List-Archive: <a
href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br>
<br>
List rules & etiquette:<br>
<a
href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm"
moz-do-not-send="true">www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a><br>
<br>
Check out or update participant bios:<br>
<a href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">www.members.re-wrenches.org</a><br>
</blockquote>
</div>
_______________________________________________<br>
List sponsored by Redwood Alliance<br>
<br>
List Address: <a
href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a><br>
<br>
Change listserver email address & settings:<br>
<a
href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br>
<br>
List-Archive: <a
href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br>
<br>
List rules & etiquette:<br>
<a
href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm"
moz-do-not-send="true">www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a><br>
<br>
Check out or update participant bios:<br>
<a href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">www.members.re-wrenches.org</a><br>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
_______________________________________________ List
sponsored by Redwood Alliance List Address:
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a> Change listserver
email address & settings:
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a>
List-Archive:
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a>
List rules & etiquette:
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm">www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a> Check out or update
participant bios: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org">www.members.re-wrenches.org</a></div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
<fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">_______________________________________________
List sponsored by Redwood Alliance
List Address: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>
Change listserver email address & settings:
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a>
List-Archive: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a>
List rules & etiquette:
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm">www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a>
Check out or update participant bios:
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org">www.members.re-wrenches.org</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
</body>
</html>