<p>Hi Jerry,</p>
<p>When I looked at Blue Planet I had to pay the sales tax as none the normal distributors would carry Blue Planet. Has that changed please? </p>
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<pre><strong><span style="font-size: small;">Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
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text 209 813 0060</span></strong></pre>
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<p>On Sun, 24 May 2020 15:23:50 -0700, Jerry Shafer <jerrysgarage01@gmail.com> wrote:</p>
<blockquote type="cite" style="padding-left:5px; border-left:#1010ff 2px solid; margin-left:5px; width:100%"><!-- html ignored --><!-- head ignored --><!-- meta ignored -->
<div dir="auto">Wrenches
<div dir="auto">Again not all batteries are the same, Chemistry, recharge rate or intelligence of the BMS, l have personally tested Blue planet batteries, l have let them sit at 100% SOC for 10 weeks, ran them at 30% SOC for 6 months, l have performed 100% to 0% cycling up to 4 times a day. This is the same tests l ran on a variety of Li tech batteries and BluePlanet is the only one that survived this testing. It's ore then spec sheets and cost, it comes down to success or failure, personally l like success and being able to pass or fail batteries without having my customers pay the price is a good thing. Blue Planet has 8000 cycles life and a 15 year warranty at 70% compare that to anything out there but again that's just me.</div>
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<div class="gmail_attr" dir="ltr">On Sun, May 24, 2020, 1:32 PM Darryl Thayer <<a href="mailto:darylsolar1@gmail.com">darylsolar1@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0 0 0 .8ex; border-left: 1px #ccc solid; padding-left: 1ex;">
<div dir="auto">I have spoken with a li battery
<div dir="auto">researcher. Do not charge over 85% of battery full charge voltage and they will last over 25 years. But go above or below bottom and trouble</div>
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<div class="gmail_attr" dir="ltr">On Sun, May 24, 2020, 10:27 AM Jay <<a href="mailto:jay.peltz@gmail.com">jay.peltz@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div>
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<div dir="auto">
<div dir="ltr">One question I have for those more versed than me in lithium is, I'm under the impression that having a lithium battery in float for years isn't good for it. Or at the very least it has to be cycled with some regularity. </div>
<div dir="ltr"> </div>
<div dir="ltr">I'd like to hear data on that</div>
<div dir="ltr"> </div>
<div dir="ltr">Thx</div>
<div dir="ltr">Jay</div>
<div dir="ltr"> </div>
<div dir="ltr">Peltz power. </div>
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<div dir="ltr"><br />
<blockquote type="cite" style="padding-left:5px; border-left:#1010ff 2px solid; margin-left:5px; width:100%">On May 23, 2020, at 10:08 PM, Ray <<a href="mailto:ray@solarray.com">ray@solarray.com</a>> wrote:<br /><br /></blockquote>
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<p>I suggest starting with a very simple look at the continuous output rating of the battery and match that to the inverter continuous rating. This ends up with quite a bit more battery than you might think at first. However, if the customer paid the big bucks for a battery backup system, they should at least get enough battery to operate the inverter at its rated power. Anything less, I would consider poor design. The same goes for lead acid batteries, they just don't work well, even on grid, when the battery is undersized. Even lead acid batteries have maximum current output ratings that should at least be matched to the inverter rating. </p>
<p>If you WERE going to under size the battery, then you should keep it safe by reducing the size of the inverter battery breaker as well. I know this "micro battery for GTB" is becoming a trend, but it doesn't mean its right. </p>
<pre>Ray Walters
Remote Solar
303 505-8760</pre>
<div>On 5/23/20 5:48 PM, Mick Abraham wrote:</div>
<blockquote type="cite" style="padding-left:5px; border-left:#1010ff 2px solid; margin-left:5px; width:100%">
<div dir="ltr">Greetings, All~ Mark Frye had asked: "...with a 4000w Outback Radian, AC coupled with 2000w of PV, what is the smallest Li battery I would want for stable operation?"
<div> </div>
<div>Mick's reply: In the lithium arena, one often finds the ratings in kilowatt-hours rather than in amp-hours. This is an easy conversion for us energy nerds to make, so below I'm mainly using watts & watt-hours with occasional conversions to amp-hours.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>I suggest that you start with the spec sheet (of whichever brand lithium battery is on your radar), & see what the manufacturer says about "allowable rate of recharge". You may find that C/2 is an acceptable rate with several manufacturers, Mark--much faster than what we're accustomed to with typical lead-acid batteries. Let's assume:</div>
<div> </div>
<div>* ...that your AC coupled PV array crests around 1800 watts to the battery when there are no loads</div>
<div>* ...that the battery is below 100% state of charge, and</div>
<div>* ...that the solar conditions are optimal. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>Let's further assume that those conditions represent your battery's highest energy rate in either direction. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>1800w X two hours = 3,600 watt-hours dividing by 48v nominal = 75 amp-hours in the above hypothetical situation. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++</div>
<div> </div>
<div>The rate at which a battery can receive energy is (usually) also the rate at which it can comfortably deplete, so let's briefly look at the flip side: Assuming the battery mfr. wants the watt-hours to be no less than two times the maximum wattage, a 3600 watt-hour (C/2) battery should not be depleted faster than 1800 watts. Your 4kW Radian, Mark, could exceed that if the loads demand it--& maybe your loads don't. Motor starting surges should probably be part of the thinking & it wouldn't hurt to ask the mfr.'s opinion about short term surges which briefly deplete the battery faster than the hypothetical two hour rate.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>By approaching this question based on the battery manufacturer do's & don'ts, one improves the chance of getting warranty coverage should it later be needed. "What the large print giveth, the fine print taketh away." </div>
<div> </div>
<div>The Wrench List is the Bomb! </div>
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<div>Mick Abraham, Proprietor<br /> <a href="http://www.abrahamsolar.com">www.abrahamsolar.com</a><br /> <br /> Landline: 970-731-4675</div>
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