<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class="">For the last five years, I start off by telling new off-grid clients that the available equipment is crap and that they should expect said equipment to fail and that they will be paying me a lot of money over the life of the system to journey out to troubleshoot and make repairs. All my clients come by referral, quite often from neighbors who\u2019s SW\u2019s and VFxs I installed have been running trouble free for for many, many years. I build a good system and go the extra mile for my clients but I refuse to subsidize manufactures by eating troubleshooting and repair costs. It seems like most of what I do these days is service related\u2026\u2026..hmm<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Michael<br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Jul 2, 2019, at 7:12 PM, William Miller <<a href="mailto:william@millersolar.com" class="">william@millersolar.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Dave:</span></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span></p><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">It is obvious that a lot of the problems are not your fault. It would seem unfair for you to bear the expense of circumstances not of your making. It is noble to have concern for the client\u2019s best interest and there is a lot to say for giving a little to build a relationship.</span></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span></p><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">It seems to me this is a perfect chance to negotiate the charges. You might consider explaining carefully to the client what has transpired and ask them what they think is fair. You might be surprised at how much they appreciate your dilemma.</span></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span></p><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">You sound like a contractor with a conscience. Good for you.</span></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span></p><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">William</span></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span></p><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">PS: Need an empty Radian carton with all the packing? I got a few on the shelf\u2026</span></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span></p><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Wm</span></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span></p><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Miller Solar</span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">17395 Oak Road, Atascadero, CA 93422</span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">805-438-5600</span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><a href="http://www.millersolar.com/" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=""><span style="color: blue;" class="">www.millersolar.com</span></a></span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">CA Lic. 773985</span></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span></p><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Quote of the month: \u201cAs they age, batteries transition from energy<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">storage devices to energy consuming devices.\u201c W. Miller</span></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span></p><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;" class="">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;" class=""><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>RE-wrenches [mailto:<a href="mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b class="">On Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Dave Tedeyan<br class=""><b class="">Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Monday, July 1, 2019 8:32 AM<br class=""><b class="">To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>RE-wrenches<br class=""><b class="">Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>[RE-wrenches] Damaged in shipping</span></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"> </p><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">Hi All, </div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">I thought I would pick the hive mind to get some thoughts on whose responsibility it is when you service a system and things go wrong beyond your control.</div></div><div class=""><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"> </p></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">Here is the situation:</div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">Outback Radian GS8048 inverter (out of warranty) goes offline and stops working. Customer calls me to check it out, and in the meantime, they had an electrician rewire the backed up loads to bypass the inverter (not realizing there was a simple bypass switch...). By the time I get there the inverter is working again. I wire the backed up loads back to the inverter, educate them about the bypass switch, and call Outback. We see some erroneous data on Optics, and so they suggest I replace all the ethernet cables with shielded cat5e. I do that, and charge the customer for the visit.</div></div><div class=""><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"> </p></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">A few days later, the inverter goes stops working again. I go back out and this time the issue is still active. Outback suspects it is one of the control boards, which cannot be field replaced. So the choices are send the whole inverter to Outback, or get a new Power stack for about $2500. So I send the inverter in. I offer to the customer to not have them pay for my labor this visit, since they already paid me to fix this issue and it did not work.</div></div><div class=""><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"> </p></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">Outback tests the inverter, finds no fault, although I ask them to replace the board anyway, since the fault was intermittent. They tested it and it was working then it left their facility. I receive it in a rough looking box. I go reinstall it, and the mate3 sees it, and the communications are okay, which is the original issue that I sent it in for. But now it will not put out any AC voltage. So a completely different issue, but still a useless piece of equipment in its current state. Tech support and I cannot determine exactly what is wrong after running through some troubleshooting steps, so they say I need to send it back to their facility. The best I can come up with is that it got damaged during shipment on the way back. (I was not excited to see that they left some poor Fedex driver to handle a 130lb package on their own....) So the inverter is currently in transit back to Outback.</div></div><div class=""><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"> </p></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">Here is the question:</div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">Would you all be charging the customer for all the time spent on troubleshooting and shipping, or at some point do you eat some of these costs? Even though (I am fairly certain) that I have done nothing negligent and none of this is my fault... but I am still not sure if it is right to charge the customer for all this back and forth when my actions have not resulted in a fixed and usable inverter. I'd appreciate anyone's thoughts and feedback on this sort of situation.</div></div><div class=""><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"> </p></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">Cheers, </div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">Dave</div></div><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"> </p></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><span style="font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;" class="">Dave Tedeyan, PE</span></b></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;" class="">Senior Engineer | Taitem Engineering, PC</span></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;" class=""><img border="0" id="_x0000_i1025" src="https://www.taitem.com/signatures/logo.png" class=""></span></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;" class="">110 South Albany Street | Ithaca, NY 14850</span></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;" class="">o.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><u class="">607.277.1118 x121</u> <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>f. 607.277.2119</span></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; 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font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">List rules & etiquette:</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class=""><a href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm" class="">www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a></span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">Check out or update participant bios:</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class=""><a href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org" class="">www.members.re-wrenches.org</a></span></div></blockquote></div><br class=""><div class="">
<div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><b class=""><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><br class=""></b></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br class=""></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-transform: none; white-space: pre; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"> </span><font color="#707070" class=""><b style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">Michael </b><b class="">Morningstar</b></font></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><b class=""><br class=""></b></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><b class=""> <span class="Apple-tab-span" style="font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; white-space: pre;"> </span><span style="font-weight: normal;" class=""><i class="">Morningstar Electric</i></span></b></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space: pre;"> </span>PO Box 1494</div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><div class=""><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space: pre;"> </span>Mount Shasta, California 96067</div><div class=""><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space: pre;"> </span>530-921-0560</div><div class=""><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space: pre;"> </span>CSLB 949635</div><div class=""> </div></div><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"> </span><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><span><span><span><img height="151" width="250" apple-inline="yes" id="E16E2A5F-7F2E-4AFA-B697-483C922116C5" apple-width="yes" apple-height="yes" src="cid:D2A6BB84-B59E-4ED1-8484-EDE18DF9A713" class=""></span>
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