<p>We have been using Midnite SPD's since they came out. The one suggestion I have is the light is too intense. I have clients who have covered the SPD's in tape to keep the light from attracting small flying insects to the electronics area. Some places just have too many bugs :( The blue seems to bring them. I saw an inverter fan filter that was an 1/8 of an inch thick with gnats.</p>
<p>Fly paper will help but the battery circuit and AC panel SPD's need some help here.</p>
<pre><strong><span>Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
<a href="http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/" target="_blank">http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/</a>
e-mail <a href="mailto:offgridsolar@sti.net">offgridsolar@sti.net</a>
text 209 813 0060</span></strong></pre>
<p> </p>
<p>On Tue, 09 Oct 2018 17:02:32 -0400, Drake <drake.chamberlin@redwoodalliance.org> wrote:</p>
<blockquote type="cite" style="padding-left:5px; border-left:#1010ff 2px solid; margin-left:5px; width:100%"><!-- html ignored --><!-- head ignored --><!-- meta ignored -->Hi boB,<br /><br /> I will keep putting an SPD on each string and on the AC line. Sometimes my systems end up with a lot of blue lights hanging from a wiring gutter!<br /><br /> Have you ever heard of any problems using the Midnite SPDs with Sunny Boy TL series inverters? So far, I don't think I've had a problem, although one TL-22, on a large metal roof, had arc fault protector trips. <br /><br /> Thanks,<br /><br /> Drake<br /><br /> <a name="_MailAutoSig"></a>Drake Chamberlin<br /> <em>Athens Electric LLC<br /> OH License 44810<br /> CO License 3773<br /> NABCEP Certified Solar PV <br /> 740-448-7328<br /> </em><a href="http://athens-electric.com/">http://athens-electric.com/</a> <br /> <br /><br /> <br /> At 01:39 PM 10/9/2018, you wrote:<br />
<blockquote class="cite">Content-Type: multipart/alternative;<br /> boundary="------------98C0DCEF93B9ECF248E0580B"<br /> Content-Language: en-US<br /><br /> <br /> For an inverter with two MPPT inputs, you will need to treat the negatives and positive lines separate unless<br /> the manufacturer says something else. That means one SPD per array unfortunately. Negative and positive connect<br /> to separate leads of the SPD and then ground in the middle. As both positive and negative PV lines rise together<br /> relative to ground, the SPD is supposed to clamp that rise to below the equipment's hi-pot voltage that they test<br /> to at the factory. (i.e. common mode voltage rise) All wires except for ground (chassis) of the equipment are tied <br /> together and the hi-pot machine (sort of like a Megger ?) applies the high voltage between all those wires on one <br /> side and ground on the other to make sure the insulation doesn't break down inside the equipment. <br /> This hi-pot test goes for AC utility input/output connections and DC from the PV input side. <br /><br /> The SPD has to clamp plus and minus and AC inputs to a lower voltage than this hipot rating but higher voltage<br /> than lines will see differentially in voltage. Remember that in a 3-wire SPD, there is two sets of MOVs in series and<br /> the center is tied to ground. If one MOV starts conducting at say, 500 volts DC then you can apply up to 1000<br /> volts between the hot leads. Each plus and negative line can rise up to 500 volts from the lightning before they<br /> start to clamp. The bigger the lightning strikes effect, the more current will be applied to the MOVs though and<br /> the clamp voltage will rise somewhat. That's why the SPD arrestor voltage should be well below the hi-pot voltage,<br /> whatever that is... Hi-pot voltages are quite a bit higher than the operating voltage. For example, All Classic CC's<br /> are tested to 2270 volts DC from hot lines to ground. It's something like double the operating voltage plus 1000V<br /> and multiply by 1.414 for DC rating..... I'm going off memory so don't quote me on that but something like that.<br /><br /> I think that Ray has the right idea about short connections like from the local generator. Battery also.<br /> Just apply SPDs to anything that goes outside like an antenna.<br /><br /> boB<br /><br /> <br /> On 10/9/2018 8:26 AM, cwarfel wrote:<br />
<blockquote class="cite"><br /> <span style="font-family: Verdana;">I think something on the order of 90+% lightning strikes come from the utility feed, not the dc side. That has to be ignored if in a high strike area or grid isolated. </span><br /><br /> On 10/8/2018 10:37 PM, Ray wrote:<br />
<blockquote class="cite"><br /> I believe you can use the SPD 300 AC on 2 strings, if PV neg is grounded. You would connect the green to ground (or PV neg) and then connect the red to one string pos, and connect the black to the other string pos. This would be limited to 300 v also. I haven't tried that exact configuration, but I have used the 300 AC to protect both the AC in and AC out on 120 vac inverters. I also believe you can use a 600 DC version, and wire as I mentioned, but the LEDs won't light. If you are using ungrounded inverters, then I think you would need an SPD for each string in order to protect both the pos and neg of each string, like you've been doing.<br /><br /> Maybe someone from Midnite can clarify this.<br /><br /> As far as it being worth it, I haven't had lightning related damage since I started using the Midnite SPDs, and I used to have system damage every year. If you are not in lightning country, or the install is in a low spot with less likelihood of taking a hit, you might be able to skimp. But for some of these off grid ridge top installs, I consider it a must. Some times I don't install one on the gen circuit, if its really close.<br /><br /> <br /><br />
<pre>Ray Walters
Remote Solar
303 505-8760</pre>
<span style="font-family: 'Courier New', Courier;"></span>On 10/8/18 4:03 PM, Drake wrote:<br />
<blockquote class="cite">Hello Wrenches,<br /><br /> Do you use surge arrestors with multi MPPT input string inverters? Do you put a separate arrestor on each MPPT input? I find it sort of pricey using a Midnite Solar arrestor on each string, but have been doing that. Is there a less expensive approach that is effective? <br /><br /> I believe the Midnite units are the best. Are they worth the expense?<br /><br /> Thank you,<br /><br /> Drake<br /> <br /> <br /> <a name="_MailAutoSig"></a>Drake Chamberlin<br /> <em>Athens Electric LLC<br /> OH License 44810<br /> CO License 3773<br /> NABCEP Certified Solar PV <br /> 740-448-7328<br /> </em><a href="http://athens-electric.com/">http://athens-electric.com/</a> <br /><br /> <br /><br /> <br />
<pre>_______________________________________________
List sponsored by Redwood Alliance
List Address:
<a href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">
RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>
Change listserver email address & settings:
<a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org">
http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a>
List-Archive:
<a href="http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html">
http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html</a>
List rules & etiquette:
<a href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm">
www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a>
Check out or update participant bios:
<a href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org">
www.members.re-wrenches.org</a>
</pre>
<span style="font-family: 'Courier New', Courier;"></span></blockquote>
<br /><br /> <br /><br />
<pre>_______________________________________________
List sponsored by Redwood Alliance
List Address:
<a href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">
RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>
Change listserver email address & settings:
<a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org">
http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a>
List-Archive:
<a href="http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html">
http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html</a>
List rules & etiquette:
<a href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm">
www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a>
Check out or update participant bios:
<a href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org">
www.members.re-wrenches.org</a>
</pre>
<span style="font-family: 'Courier New', Courier;"></span></blockquote>
<br /> -- <br /><br /> <span style="font-size: small;"> Christopher Warfel, PE<br /> ENTECH Engineering, Inc.<br /> PO Box 871, Block Island, RI 02807<br /> (401)466-8978</span><br /> <br /> <a href="http://entech-engineering.com"> <img src="cid:fa605fa29a063e3de384e32289a84138@sti.net" alt="EEI logo" width="201" height="89" /> </a> <br /><br /> <br /><br />
<pre>_______________________________________________
List sponsored by Redwood Alliance
List Address:
<a href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">
RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>
Change listserver email address & settings:
<a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org">
http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a>
List-Archive:
<a href="http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html">
http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html</a>
List rules & etiquette:
<a href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm">
www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a>
Check out or update participant bios:
<a href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org">
www.members.re-wrenches.org</a>
</pre>
<span style="font-family: 'Courier New', Courier;"></span></blockquote>
<br /><br /> <br /> _______________________________________________<br /> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance<br /><br /> List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org<br /><br /> Change listserver email address & settings:<br /> <a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org"> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a> <br /><br /> List-Archive: <a href="http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html"> http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html</a> <br /><br /> List rules & etiquette:<br /> <a href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm"> www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a><br /><br /> Check out or update participant bios:<br /> <a href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org/"> www.members.re-wrenches.org</a></blockquote>
</blockquote>
<div>-- <br />
<pre> </pre>
<pre> </pre>
</div>