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<p>I started recommending people use the new ECM drive circ pumps.
They use half the power and are a direct replacement. Have your
plumber check out the Taco e series, or the Grundfos Alpha series
of circ pumps. <br>
</p>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Ray Walters
Remote Solar
303 505-8760</pre>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 9/7/18 8:45 PM, David Palumbo wrote:<br>
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<p class="MsoNormal">El Sid 10W DC pumps are great but in my
experience they did not have the flow and head \u201coomph\u201d for
long runs for the zones on our second and third floors with
our hydronic heating system (wood boiler). In our off grid
house we installed El Sid\u2019s on all 4 zones in the late 1980\u2019s.
We had recurring problems with the 2<sup>nd</sup> and 3<sup>rd</sup>
floor zones (long runs) becoming air bound repeatedly after a
couple of months of heavy use in the winter. Basement and 1<sup>st</sup>
floor zones did not have this problem. I consulted with some
plumbing and heating folks and ended up replacing the 2<sup>nd</sup>
and 3<sup>rd</sup> floor zone El Sid\u2019s with 115VAC Grundfos
circ pumps. Problem solved, no more air lock problems. I had a
hard time understanding that while the El Sid\u2019s worked OK on
the longer, higher head zones but did not have the power to
avoid the air lock situation in our heating system. One of the
plumbers explained it to me twenty something years ago BUT I
don\u2019t recall his explanation now. Maybe some wrench with more
hydronic chops than I can explain it.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Dave Palumbo</p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Independent Power</p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Hyde Park, VT</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Sent from <a
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="border:none;padding:0in"><b>From:
</b><a href="mailto:bbassett2@gmail.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">Bradley Bassett</a><br>
<b>Sent: </b>Friday, September 7, 2018 10:09 PM<br>
<b>To: </b><a
href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">RE-wrenches</a><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [RE-wrenches] Forced air Furnace</p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I have multiple ElSid pumps in my
heating system which have been running for just about 15
years without the slightest hitch. At 10W each they are
hard to beat, but they do need DC so a power supply is
needed. I ran them off 24VDC direct from the battery for
the first 10 years and from a small MeanWell power supply
for the last 5 years. My only complaint is that when there
are 4 of them running it sounds like a miniature WWII
bomber. No loud enough to hear outside of the utility room
but something to keep in mind.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Brad Bassett</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">AEE Solar</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Brad</p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Fri, Sep 7, 2018 at 7:33 AM Drake
<<a href="mailto:drake.chamberlin@redwoodalliance.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">drake.chamberlin@redwoodalliance.org</a>>
wrote:</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Dana, <br>
<br>
Your comments, and other comments on this list have made
me see the light. We are going to go with a boiler. <br>
<br>
What is the best source of equipment for this
application these days? <br>
<br>
Many years ago, I helped install a system in Colorado
using El Sid pumps, with guidance from you, if you
recall this ancient history. <br>
<br>
Cheers,<br>
<br>
Drake <br>
<br>
<a name="m_-8249959848673430069__MailAutoSig"
moz-do-not-send="true"></a>Drake Chamberlin<br>
<i>Athens Electric LLC<br>
OH License 44810<br>
CO License 3773<br>
NABCEP Certified Solar PV <br>
740-448-7328<br>
</i><a href="http://athens-electric.com/"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">http://athens-electric.com/</a>
<br>
<br>
<br>
At 07:43 PM 8/23/2018, you wrote:<br>
<br>
</p>
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boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0068_01D43B08.DFB2A130"<br>
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<br>
Drake,<br>
All the conventional units I have amp clamped over the
years are pushing 900-900+ watts per hour. I do not
recommend them ever & to date I have never found a
lower wattage blower. I would assume that a permanent
magnet motor would fit this suggestion, but I have not
found one.<br>
For off grid I recommend: Radiant floor heat first and
hot water base board second long before hot air. Air
is a better insulator than a heat transfer agent.<br>
The new ECM (electronically commutated motors) pump
motors are basically at DC permanent magnet motor
power draws [Taco & Grundfoss] these days.<br>
<br>
Best of luck with this one.<br>
<br>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------<br>
Dana Orzel Great Solar
Works, Inc. <br>
<b>C - 208.721.7003 <a
href="mailto:dana@solarwork.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">dana@solarwork.com</a><br>
</b>Idaho Contractor - # 028765 Idaho PV #
028374<br>
NABCEP # 051112-136 <a
href="http://www.solarwork.biz" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">www.solarwork.biz</a><br>
<u>"Responsible Technologies for Responsible People
since 1988" <br>
</u><b>P</b> Please consider the environment before
printing this email.<br>
<br>
<br>
<b>From:</b> RE-wrenches <<a
href="mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Drake<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, August 23, 2018 2:37 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> RE-wrenches <<a
href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [RE-wrenches] Forced air Furnace<br>
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:.5in">Hello
Wrenches,</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:.5in">What
is the best choice for a propane, forced air furnace
for an off grid house? We would prefer one that
doesn't have a phantom load, although the transformer
for the thermostat may not be avoidable. Low blower
current would be preferable. The furnace AC will be
powered by a Magnum 4448 PAE.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:.5in">Thank
you,</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:.5in">Drake
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Drake
Chamberlin</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Athens
Electric LLC</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">OH License
44810</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">CO License
3773</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">NABCEP
Certified Solar PV </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">740-448-7328</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:.5in"><a
href="http://athens-electric.com/" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">http://athens-electric.com/</a>
</p>
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