<html><head></head><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:13px"><div><span></span></div><div class="qtdSeparateBR" id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1515588621894_49488" dir="ltr"><br>In the past I determined that anything above a 4 pitch on standing seam roofs would require rails. Just too difficult otherwise. I would recommend the use of rails all the time however on larger systems, there can be significant added cost. Because the seams don't align as a perfect multiple of the module length or width, you do end up having some modules with a greater spacing between supports than perhaps the module spec sheet requires. </div><div class="qtdSeparateBR" id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1515588621894_49520" dir="ltr">Additionally I have found that for multiple home run strings, a stainless steel retaining clip dunked in rubber (mfg that way), is a good way to bundle the wires. Even better is to use a flexible conduit with a slit to run the home run wiring up / across under the array, where the conduit supports are on S-5 clips. Sorry don't have access to pictures at the moment.</div><div class="qtdSeparateBR" dir="ltr">Mike Kocsmiersky</div><div class="qtdSeparateBR" dir="ltr">Spirit Solar<br></div><div class="yahoo_quoted" id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1515588621894_49391" style="display: block;"> <div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1515588621894_49390" style="font-family: Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 13px;"> <div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1515588621894_49389" style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;"> <div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1515588621894_49388" dir="ltr"> <font id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1515588621894_49387" face="Arial" size="2"> <hr size="1"> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">From:</span></b> "re-wrenches-request@lists.re-wrenches.org" <re-wrenches-request@lists.re-wrenches.org><br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org <br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Thursday, January 11, 2018 3:43 PM<br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> RE-wrenches Digest, Vol 11, Issue 13<br> </font> </div> <div class="y_msg_container" id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1515588621894_49392"><br><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1515588621894_49530" dir="ltr">Send RE-wrenches mailing list submissions to<br></div><div dir="ltr"> <a href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org" ymailto="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a><br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1515588621894_49521" dir="ltr">To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit<br></div><div dir="ltr"> <a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/listinfo.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org" target="_blank">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/listinfo.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1515588621894_49522" dir="ltr">or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to<br></div><div dir="ltr"> <a href="mailto:re-wrenches-request@lists.re-wrenches.org" ymailto="mailto:re-wrenches-request@lists.re-wrenches.org">re-wrenches-request@lists.re-wrenches.org</a><br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1515588621894_49523" dir="ltr">You can reach the person managing the list at<br></div><div dir="ltr"> <a href="mailto:re-wrenches-owner@lists.re-wrenches.org" ymailto="mailto:re-wrenches-owner@lists.re-wrenches.org">re-wrenches-owner@lists.re-wrenches.org</a><br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific<br></div><div dir="ltr">than "Re: Contents of RE-wrenches digest..."<br></div>When responding to posts within the Digest, be sure to restore the Subject: line to the original, and please edit out any extraneous lines from the quoted message.<br> Today's Topics:<br><br> 1. Wire management with S5! Railless System (Hilton Dier)<br> 2. Re: Wire management with S5! Railless System (August Goers)<br> 3. This is as admin test message, please do not respond<br> (Michael Welch)<br> 4. This is as admin test message, please do not respond<br> (Michael Welch)<br><div class="ymsg8637223052" id="ymsg86360" src="mid://ADyq1QoAADOQWlfahAc_eM7U-_Q/4.1">Add my voice to the \u201cnever without rails\u201d chorus. <br><br>1) S-5 clamps are only as good as the standing seam they are on. At least rails spread out the stresses and avoid large point loads. <br><br>2) Ice likes to slide. Rails give some height above that. <br><br>3) Rail height gives better ventilation and hot weather performance.<br><br>4) Module width is never an even multiple of roofing pan width. No rails means inevitably some modules will be \u201cdiving boards.\u201d<br><br>5) Without rails, getting the modules to an even height is a giant PITA. Takes forever. I did it once and never again.<br><br>Best<br><br>Hilton<br><br>Hilton Dier III<br>Renewable Energy Design<br>Missisquoi River Hydro LLC<br></div><div class="ymsg8637223052" id="ymsg84475" src="mid://ADyq1QoAADOQWlfahAc_eM7U-_Q/4.2">Ray - I agree with the others that S5 clamps with rails is the way to go on<br>standing seam roofs. We buy our S5 clamps through LMCurbs and I've found<br>their pricing and service to be good: <a href="http://www.lmcurbs.com/" target="_blank">http://www.lmcurbs.com/</a><br><br>We go though a good deal of effort to determine the exact standing seam<br>make/model and then procure the S5 clamps that are specifically designed<br>for the roof. Even then, sometimes the seams need to be compressed a bit to<br>slip the clamp over. You can squeeze the seams with a large pair of channel<br>locks with a piece or cardboard to protect the channel lock teeth from<br>marring the metal standing seam coating.<br><br>If you still need to run PV wires along modules frames without rails,<br>HellermannTyton might make a product that will work for you:<br><a href="http://www.hellermanntyton.us/industry.aspx?id=3132" target="_blank">http://www.hellermanntyton.us/industry.aspx?id=3132</a><br>You might be able to get a solar sampler kit from them to find a good fit.<br><br>Best,<br><br>August<br>Luminalt<br><br><br>On Wed, Jan 10, 2018 at 9:18 PM, Ray <<a href="mailto:ray@solarray.com" ymailto="mailto:ray@solarray.com">ray@solarray.com</a>> wrote:<br><br>> Hi All;<br>><br>> I was wondering what folks were doing these days for wire management on<br>> Standing seam roofs with the S5! clamps and no rails. I'm at a loss (once<br>> again) for how to secure the home runs without a rail. I have some of<br>> those module edge clips, but those only hold one wire, and I've had them<br>> slip off (wire dangling visible from ground.)<br>> Also most suppliers seem to only carry the universal S5! clamps, but I<br>> have found those to really bend up the metal on certain types of standing<br>> seam roofs. I wanted to order the recommended model for the particular<br>> roof. AEE quit carrying S5 altogether.<br>> Give me your Standing seam wisdom.<br>><br>> Thanks,<br>><br>> Ray Walters<br>> Remote Solar<br>> _______________________________________________<br>> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance<br>><br>> List Address: <a id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1515588621894_49532" href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org" ymailto="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a><br>><br>> Change listserver email address & settings:<br>> <a id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1515588621894_49531" href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org" target="_blank">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br>><br>> List-Archive: <a id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1515588621894_49533" href="http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.or" target="_blank">http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.or</a><br>> g/maillist.html<br>><br>> List rules & etiquette:<br>> www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm<br>><br>> Check out or update participant bios:<br>> www.members.re-wrenches.org<br>><br>><br><br><br></div><div class="ymsg8637223052" id="ymsg05947" src="mid://ADyq1QoAADOQWlfahAc_eM7U-_Q/4.3">Hi gang. I'm still testing file attachments, please do not respond. <br><br>Sorry to bother you with these, but getting this figured out is important. <br><br></div><div class="ymsg8637223052" id="ymsg86384" src="mid://ADyq1QoAADOQWlfahAc_eM7U-_Q/4.4">Hi gang. Yet another test, please do not respond. <br><br>Sorry to bother you with these, but getting this figured out is important. </div>_______________________________________________<br>List sponsored by Redwood Alliance<br><br>List Address: <a href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org" ymailto="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>Change listserver email address & settings:<br><a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org" target="_blank">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>List-Archive: <a href="http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html" target="_blank">http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html</a><br><br>List rules & etiquette:<br>www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm<br><br>Check out or update participant bios:<br>www.members.re-wrenches.org<br><br><br></div> </div> </div> </div></div></body></html>