<html><head></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">An apprenticeship is the original 4 year degree. If the trainers are good, high quality workpersons, and the apprentice WANTS to learn, the apprentice will learn the trade. It's exactly the same in a college situation except that the newly minted journeyman, unlike a college graduate, will actually HAVE a trade and experience.<div><br><div><div>On Apr 17, 2015, at 5:41 PM, Chris Mason wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><p dir="ltr">The US currently puts little value on craft versus academia, now everyone smart is expected to go to college. Consequently there is a stigma on vocational education. When I did my electrical apprenticeship in Ireland, we did two years of college, one year of training school and one year in the field. There were 8, 000 applicants for a handful of positions. <br>
I had a third year electrical apprentice from the US work for me on a three month project we took on. He was absolutely unqualified and could not answer the most basic questions on electrical theory. <br>
I recommend you detail the educational opportunities and fund adequate training enabling the apprentice to acheive the target qualification.</p>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Apr 17, 2015 4:53 PM, "Ray Walters" <<a href="mailto:ray@solarray.com">ray@solarray.com</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
Hi All;<br>
<br>
Thanks for the replies so far; I apologize for my misunderstood
attempt at humor in my initial post. I agree with Chris here, I
hire contract labor all the time, but an apprenticeship is
different. Laborers top out pretty quickly and just aren't capable
of learning the nuances of off grid electric design. Much of the
time that's all that's needed: pick this up and take it over
there,dig here, etc. I'm not looking for labor, as much as someone
who could some day take over the business ( I'm 50 now) and go out
and troubleshoot systems on their own. I consider off grid solar to
be more of a craft than mere construction contracting.<br>
An apprenticeship implies a much longer term arrangement where they
may be paid less, but can expect training to the point of getting
their electrical license and making a career out of it. I'm having
a much harder time finding the sort of person that wants to make
that sort of commitment both in time and in learning. Folks that
have the smarts and ambition necessary are already busy.<br>
<br>
Thanks,<br>
<pre cols="72">R.Ray Walters
CTO, Solarray, Inc
Nabcep Certified PV Installer,
Licensed Master Electrician
Solar Design Engineer
<a href="tel:303%20505-8760" value="+13035058760" target="_blank">303 505-8760</a></pre>
<div>On 4/17/2015 6:22 AM, Chris Mason
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">I'm not sure how the term is used in America, but
generally "apprentice" does not mean cheap labour. An apprentice
program should be an education path to a qualification with
state recognized standards, such as Electrician or Plumber. if
you just want inexpensive labour, that's not an apprentice,
that's a helper, labourer, intern. As someone who started life
as an electrical apprentice, I object to seeing apprenticeships
shortchanging the applicants.</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Apr 16, 2015 at 7:27 PM, Dana <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:dana@solarwork.com" target="_blank">dana@solarwork.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="white" link="blue" vlink="purple" lang="EN-US">
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span>I
interview & definitely check references
including: look at a tape measure and tell me what
those little marks are between 0 & 1, & I
look in their truck or car. </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span>If
its clean they may take care of your vehicle then
same and if its a mess thats what you can expect
them to do to your truck. </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span>Are
they smokers? Is that OK in your truck?</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span>Can
they work without checking their cell phone every
time it goes Ding or rings?</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span>Do
they have their own tools and do they know how to
operate tools like your hydraulic draw punch or wire
tugger without F%$ing it up or hurting themselves?</span></p><div><span> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span>Does
anyone do a background check on new hires?</span></p><div><span> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span>----------------------------------------------------------------------------</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span>Dana
Orzel </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span>Great
Solar Works, Inc - NABCEP # 051112-136</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span>E
- <a href="mailto:dana@solarwork.com" target="_blank">dana@solarwork.com</a>
- Web - <a href="http://solarwork.com/" target="_blank">solarwork.com</a>
</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span>O
- <a href="tel:970.626.5253" value="+19706265253" target="_blank">970.626.5253</a> C - <a href="tel:208.721.7003" value="+12087217003" target="_blank">208.721.7003</a></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span>"Responsible
Technologies for Responsible People since 1988" </span><span></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><b><span style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Webdings;color:green">P</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:navy">
</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:green">Please
consider the environment before printing this
email.</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif""></span></p><div><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
</div><div><span> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext">
RE-wrenches [mailto:<a href="mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org" target="_blank">re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Ray Walters<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 16, 2015 4:50 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> RE-wrenches<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [RE-wrenches] Apprentice</span></p>
</div>
</div><div> <br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><p class="MsoNormal">Hi Folks;<br>
<br>
I am considering hiring an apprentice, and I wanted to
know if any else has tried this, and what advice and
experience everyone had to offer.<br>
Also what would be the best way to advertise: Craig's
List? <i><br>
<br>
Wanted passionate techy soul to share warm fires and
cold brews with, watch beautiful sunsets over off
grid arrays in remote locations, sometimes carry
leaky hazardous materials</i>.....<br>
mmmm. Obviously I need some help.<br>
<br>
Thanks in Advance,<br>
<br>
</p>
<pre>-- </pre>
<pre>R.Ray Walters</pre>
<pre>CTO, Solarray, Inc</pre>
<pre>Nabcep Certified PV Installer, </pre>
<pre>Licensed Master Electrician</pre>
<pre>Solar Design Engineer</pre>
<pre><a href="tel:303%20505-8760" value="+13035058760" target="_blank">303 505-8760</a></pre>
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-- <br>
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<div dir="ltr">Chris Mason
<div>
<div style="color:rgb(136,136,136)"><span style="font-size:13px">NABCEP Certified Solar PV
Installer</span></div>
<div style="color:rgb(136,136,136)"><span style="color:rgb(34,34,34)">Solar Design Engineer</span></div>
<div style="color:rgb(136,136,136)"><span style="font-size:13px">Generac Generators Industrial
technician</span></div>
</div>
<div style="color:rgb(136,136,136)"><span style="font-size:13px"><br>
</span></div>
<div><a href="http://www.cometenergysystems.com/" target="_blank">www.cometsolar.com</a></div>
<div><a href="tel:264.235.5670" value="+12642355670" target="_blank">264.235.5670</a></div>
<div><a href="tel:869.662.5670" value="+18696625670" target="_blank">869.662.5670</a></div>
<div>Skype: netconcepts</div>
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