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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>Bill,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>I haven’t tested
temperature gradients, so in that respect I can’t answer your question.
Also, my post was a cautionary note to Kirpal to evaluate the temperature
effects in deciding whether to stack flooded batteries. But he noted “big
banks” and “7000 pounds”, both of which suggest tall flooded
LA batteries – typically 26” tall. Given that some degree of visual
access into the cells from above is necessary, we’re talking at least
about 6’ from floor to top of upper row. This is more than the 35”
or so of the Outback cabinet, and likely to result in stratification nearly commensurate
with the floor-to-ceiling differences in the battery room.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>It was Jeff at Direct Power who
wisely cautioned me against this years ago when I wanted to stack Concordes
floor to ceiling in a confined space. We ended up using the Outback cabinets
that you mention, keeping the total height below 35”.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>Allan Sindelar<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#1F497D'><a
href="mailto:Allan@positiveenergysolar.com">Allan@positiveenergysolar.com</a></span><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#1F497D'>NABCEP
Certified Photovoltaic Installer</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;
color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#1F497D'>EE98J
Journeyman Electrician</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>Positive
Energy, Inc.<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>3201 Calle
Marie<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>Santa Fe, New
Mexico 87507<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>505 424-1112<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#1F497D'><a
href="http://www.positiveenergysolar.com/">www.PositiveEnergySolar.com</a></span><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>
re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Bill
Loesch<br>
</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi
Allan, et al,</span><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Just
what amount of temperature difference (and corresponding SOC
difference) are we talking about? </span><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>In
previous incarnations, Outback produced an attractive albeit
very labor intensive unassembled battery cabinet which, if my old memory
is correct, this optionally _enclosed_ battery cabinet could enclose
three(?) 8D batteries in a ~four foot high box with an ~ 8D footprint. If this isn't
the near ultimate of an"indoor space" with corresponding temperature
stratification please advise of a more confined space application. </span><span
style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Wouldn't
the current Outback stacked Group 27 cabinet be subject to the same
physics?</span><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Thanks
for your superior use of the thinking cap and literally thinking "outside
the box".</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Bill
Loesch<br>
Solar 1 - Saint Louis Solar<br>
314 631 1094</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;
margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-----
Original Message ----- <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:#E4E4E4'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> <a href="mailto:solarworks@gmail.com"
title="solarworks@gmail.com">Kirpal Khalsa</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>To:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> <a
href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org"
title="re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">RE-wrenches</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sent:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> Monday, October 19,
2009 7:05 PM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Subject:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> Re: [RE-wrenches]
Battery Racks<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Allan......very good point...I
had not thunk that far......It will probably be a good difference in temp.
too.....I am not quite sure how we would address that as the system will only
have one charging source and 2 strings of batteries.....one on the top shelf
and one on the bottom....???? Any ideas? I my initial inclination would be to
lean towards putting the temp sensor on the top string as over heating of the
battery bank due to over charging is probably a bigger concern than being very
cold as this is in a residential garage with out much insulation in relatively
mild wintered Oregon....<br>
Thanks to all for their ideas and recommendations....this list and its members
are definitely a priceless resource.....I would gladly share my chantrelle
mushroom loot i just pulled out of the forest with you all were you here right
now!<br>
Cheers....<br>
-- <br>
Sunny Regards,<br>
Kirpal Khalsa<span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>On Mon, Oct 19, 2009 at 1:12
PM, Allan Sindelar <<a href="mailto:allan@positiveenergysolar.com">allan@positiveenergysolar.com</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='color:#1F497D'>Kirpal,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='color:#1F497D'>Keep in mind variations in upper- and lower-bank
temperatures from ambient heat stratification if the batteries are in an indoor
space. This affects relative SOC among strings, affecting string life.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Sent:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>
Monday, October 19, 2009 1:47 PM</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Hi
All.....anyone have any experience with battery racking systems for big banks
of flooded lead acid batteries? Typically we don't like to stack flooded
batteries but we may not have space for as big of a bank as we need if we don't
stack......Any one know of a company that engineers racks that are seismically
sound, have the ability to have spill containment all while maintaining some
accessibility? I know DPW makes battery racks but looking at their web
site they are typically smaller than what we need.....<br>
We need to support roughly 7000lbs.....and are exploring if this is even
doable....<br>
Cheers and thanks!<br clear=all>
-- <br>
Sunny Regards,<br>
Kirpal Khalsa<o:p></o:p></p>
</blockquote>
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