<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div dir="ltr"></div><div dir="ltr">I tried playing around with it but it didn’t seem to make much difference </div><div dir="ltr">But the instructions are pretty bad so I might have not done it correctly </div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr"><br><blockquote type="cite">On May 14, 2025, at 6:22 PM, Kevin Pegg via RE-wrenches <re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:<br><br></blockquote></div><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">The fan on the 6000XP is quite loud. You can program this. Using the poral maintenance / advanced settings / then other settings near the bottom. You can adjust the slope, and the max speed. It seems to me
the default speed slope is way too eager to get that fan roaring. But I have not yet played with this.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Kevin<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> RE-wrenches <re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Chris Daum via RE-wrenches<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, May 14, 2025 9:57 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'RE-wrenches' <re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org><br>
<b>Cc:</b> chris@OasisMontana.com<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [RE-wrenches] EG4 inverter noise<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Just as an aside, is anyone else having major noise problems with the EG4 inverters? We’ve only sold one and its output is – seriously -- 90 decibels. My customer is rather deaf but his wife is not and
it’s driving her/them nuts. I am rather reluctant to sell another unless they have a separate power shed or the like.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Chris Daum<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Oasis Montana Inc. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> RE-wrenches <<a href="mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org">re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Maverick Brown via RE-wrenches<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, May 14, 2025 10:18 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> RE-wrenches <<a href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Maverick Brown <<a href="mailto:maverick@mavericksolar.com">maverick@mavericksolar.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [RE-wrenches] Midnite AIO Generator Functionality<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">In the case of extra redundancy, I have installed the EG4 Chargeverter and a 30A L14-30 Inlet and made the customer a suitable length L14-30 Extension Cord that they can use with their manual start secondary / tertiary portable generator
just in case the primary generator has failed to start. The Chargeverter is quite small and can handle about 5kW of charge just in case… The charge voltage is programmable as is the current. It is inverter and battery agnostic.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">The Chargeverter used to be inexpensive compared to what it does. The last time I checked it is over $700 and also always seems to be on backorder. Still worth it. The Chargeverter has two wire start and can start based on voltage and SOC
(if that is where the batteries are communicating / not that useful for most cases).<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">If the Chargeverter is the primary generator AC to DC Charger, all AIO inverters could benefit from DC Generator = Y / N setting. Reference : Available setting on XW and Outback. <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">For that matter, I am sure there are other suitable chargers that can be added as an emergency spare. Ten years ago or more, I added an IOTA charger to 24V FX inverter so the customer could use their Honda 2000 to charge the battery without
the warbling electricity going into the house because FX sans PF correction… Remember those fun days?<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">>> Generator<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">>>> Generator<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">>>>> Candles<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">Maverick Brown<br>
Off-Grid Solar Commander since 2006<br>
<b>Maverick Solar Enterprises, Inc.</b><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"> • Solar Commander Remote Power</span></b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"> • SunFlow Systems Cathodic Protection <br>
</span></b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"><a href="mailto:maverick@mavericksolar.com">maverick@mavericksolar.com</a><br>
512-460-9825<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On May 14, 2025, at 8:55<span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span>AM, Jason Szumlanski via RE-wrenches <<a href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">That is the idea, but the generator startup is not guaranteed (i.e.out of fuel, battery dead, etc). It's not a failsafe solution. <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">The AIO really needs a dedicated GEN input that is not controlled with a NO relay. Or let us use the Grid input for the generator. The generator input logic is severely flawed. If there is an AC source, it should be able to charge the battery
without user intervention. <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
Jason Szumlanski<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Roboto;color:#333333">Principal Solar Designer | Florida Solar Design Group<br>
NABCEP Certified Solar Professional (PVIP)<br>
Florida State Certified Solar Contractor CVC56956</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Roboto;color:#333333">Florida Certified Electrical Contractor EC13013208</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Mon, May 12, 2025, 5:25<span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span>PM Dave Tedeyan via RE-wrenches <<a href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Jason, <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Cant you just make the AGS turn on the generator before the inverter gets to the LBCO? Maybe this is more difficult if you do not have closed loop comms and the SOC drifts. I am just working through my first Midnite AIO setup now, so I
cannot speak to the nuances of how it will work with that yet.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Cheers,<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Dave<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Mon, May 12, 2025 at 4:01<span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span>PM Ray Walters via RE-wrenches <<a href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org" target="_blank">re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p>That has not been my experience. I have had to manually reboot Solark systems numerous time off grid. If there is snow on the array or otherwise low PV output for a few days, the no load draw of the BMS then takes the battery voltage low enough to shut
the battery off. This would be a different situation with a knowledgeable owner onsite full time, but for vacation properties, it will go into complete shut down, not coming back.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p>Which gets into the manual and tech support for Solark: its really not clear what the different settings do, and how they interact. I'm sure there are engineers that know, but they aren't at Tech support. At least you can change the programming on the
touch screen, and you don't have to get a quirky app up off grid to do basic changes. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p>BTW, what happens when the developers quit keeping the App updated, 10 years from now, and you can't access the programming? Planned Obsolescence? That 33 yr old Trace Inverter is still doing its job.....<o:p></o:p></p>
<p>Ray Walters<br>
Remote Solar<o:p></o:p></p>
<p><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On 5/12/2025 11:33 AM, MDElectricSolar via RE-wrenches wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">We have been using the Solark inverter for GTBB and off grid clients. In the case of low battery cut out the solar does stay alive in the background and will recharge the batteries when the sun comes out the next day and turn itself back
on and provide AC power output. <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Michael D Nelson<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">MD Electric & Solar, Inc.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">707-684-0064 mobile<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">707-884-1862 office<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="http://www.mdelectricsolar.com/" target="_blank">www.mdelectricsolar.com</a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="http://www.facebook.com/mdelectricandsolar" target="_blank">www.facebook.com/mdelectricandsolar</a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">On May 12, 2025, at 10:13<span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span>AM, Ray Walters via RE-wrenches
<a href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org" target="_blank"><re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org></a> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"></span> <o:p>
</o:p></p>
<p>So the bypass switch gets the house power on, and I too always recommend a hard bypass switch. However, you still need a 48 v power supply to get the battery system back up, and that's becoming a serious pain in my aging backside. Until AIOs with Li+ batteries,
lead acid would have enough voltage to get the charge controller to come back on, and eventually the customer could get the inverter back on too. No special trip out. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p>We need an independent circuit that would sense array voltage, and wake up the battery, so it could take a charge: a backup battery for the offgrid battery. Without that, AIOs and Li+ batteries are not self healing like Lead Acid. We are going backwards
fast, but with an amazing amount of new Chinese technology driving the jalopy in reverse. (Danger Will Robinson)<o:p></o:p></p>
<p>Ray Walters<br>
Remote Solar<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On 5/12/2025 10:54 AM, Jason Szumlanski via RE-wrenches wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">We always recommend a transfer switch to bypass the inverter and send generator power to the loads. Most clients take us up on it. For retrofits, sometimes there can be space limitations, however. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">As for the function of the AIO, there is no integrated mechanical bypass, and since there is an internal relay controlling the generator input (or smart load output on that breaker), I think
the default function is for the relay to open when the inverter turns off. AC voltage on the load side of the breaker does not close the relay and turn the inverter back on automatically.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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Jason Szumlanski <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Roboto;color:#333333">Principal Solar Designer | Florida Solar Design Group<br>
NABCEP Certified Solar Professional (PVIP)<br>
Florida State Certified Solar Contractor CVC56956</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Roboto;color:#333333">Florida Certified Electrical Contractor EC13013208</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Mon, May 12, 2025 at 9:49<span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span>AM Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches <<a href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org" target="_blank">re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#333333">All sounds wrong to me. Call Midnite. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#333333"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#333333">Typically there is a AC bypass mechanical switch that allows the gen to bypass the inverter and power loads.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<pre> <o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><strong><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"">Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar<o:p></o:p></span></strong></pre>
<pre><strong><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"">"we go where powerlines don't"<o:p></o:p></span></strong></pre>
<pre><strong><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Courier New""><a href="http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/" target="_blank"> </a><a href="https://offgridsolar1.com/" target="_blank"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;background:white;font-weight:normal">https://offgridsolar1.com/</span></a><a href="http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/" target="_blank"> </a><o:p></o:p></span></strong></pre>
<pre><strong><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"">e-mail <a href="mailto:offgridsolar@sti.net" target="_blank">offgridsolar@sti.net</a><o:p></o:p></span></strong></pre>
<pre><strong><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"">text 209 813 0060</span></strong><o:p></o:p></pre>
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<span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">On 2025-05-12 9:29 am, Jason Szumlanski via RE-wrenches wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Maybe I'm missing something, but it seems like there is a flaw in the logic for how generator integration works with this product. Unlike some of the other AIOs, you can't put the generator on
the Grid input in an off-grid scenario. You have to use the Generator smart load breaker, which isn't a dedicated generator input, but a programmable circuit. This is problematic because it seemingly has a normally open internal relay that closes only when
the inverter is ON. At least, that's how it seems to work in my limited experience.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Why is this a problem? If the battery capacity drops below the low voltage cutoff, the inverter turns off. You have to turn the inverter ON for the generator relay to close so you can charge
the battery, but since the battery is too low, the inverter won't turn on. You would have to reprogram the inverter to drop the cutoff voltage/SOC below the current battery state. For people who do not want to use AGS, or if AGS fails to start the generator
for any reason, getting the generator to charge the battery manually is no easy task.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Moreover, turning the generator on manually when the inverter is in an OFF state will not pass power to the loads, and will not turn the inverter ON automatically. You have to get the inverter
turned ON somehow so that the generator power can pass through to the loads. And since the startup sequence for this inverter is very quirky, non-intuitive, and unreliable, that makes the problem even worse. I'm not sure if you can even turn the inverter ON
when there is generator input and the battery is too low. I don't think you can because the relay is open and the inverter doesn't even see generator voltage when it is in an OFF state.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">This seems like a serious oversight and a reason to go with one of the other AIOs on the market. I believe the Sol-Ark 15K and EG4 18kPV will both immediately power loads and start charging when
the generator is on, regardless of whether the generator is connected to the Grid or Generator input. Any AC input immediately passes through to the loads. This is because those inverters stay "on" when a low battery condition is met, and they simply stop
using the battery to invert power if the battery conditions do not allow it, based on the settings. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">The logic of the Midnite AIOs turning "off" when battery cutoff is met and opening the generator relay doesn't make sense to me. Am I wrong about how this works?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">Jason Szumlanski
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">Principal Solar Designer<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">Florida Solar Design Group<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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