<div dir="auto">We also never had luck with a laser, although early on that is something we definitely tried. We use a string line. We keep drops of 2x4 that are cut to the length of our most common panel sizes, and fasten them on to the rails with mid clips. That way we can easily reference where the top and bottom of the row will end up.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">The installers can choose to run their stringline on the top of the 2x4 or on the bottom (depending on the logistics of that particular row). Its good to double check the string line in reference to the ridge, shingle line or drip line in various places before installing. </div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Then they set the second panel in the row and work their way down. Once the row is complete the 2x4s and string line are dropped, the rails are cut to length (we run them wild originally, and cut them flush at the end) and the first and last panel are installed </div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">One of our installers worked for a much larger company at some point, and he said they didn’t use a string at all. Their method was to “keep someone on the ground who just looked at the row and told them if it seemed like it was going straight”. Seems like a disaster waiting to happen to me …but that company has a lot of installs in the area and they look fine.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto"><br clear="all"><div dir="auto"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div>Adam Katzman (he/him)<br>Autonomous Energies | Owner/Operator</div><div dir="ltr"><a href="http://www.autonomousenergies.com" target="_blank">www.AutonomousEnergies.com</a><br>(518) 567-1468<br></div></div><br></div></div></div></div></div></div><div><br></div><div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Oct 4, 2024 at 2:44 AM William Miller via RE-wrenches <<a href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204)"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple"><div class="m_-6677537030589897208WordSection1"><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Jay:</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Is there a make and model of laser you recommend? I bought a pretty expensive one and it was useless in daylight. </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">The goal is to make the rails parallel, not necessarily straight or level. I’m not sure a laser level is the right tool for this goal. </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Running a laser line at other than level or plumb was not that easy when I tried it and that seems necessary, so I am looking for hints on your process. </span></p></div></div><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple"><div class="m_-6677537030589897208WordSection1"><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">William</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Miller Solar</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">17395 Oak Road, Atascadero, CA 93422</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">805-438-5600</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><a href="http://www.millersolar.com/" target="_blank" style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:blue">www.millersolar.com</span></a></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">CA Lic. 773985</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><div><div style="border-style:solid none none;border-top-width:1pt;padding:3pt 0in 0in;border-top-color:rgb(181,196,223)"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"> RE-wrenches [mailto:<a href="mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org" target="_blank" style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>] <b style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">On Behalf Of </b>Jay via RE-wrenches<br><b style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">Sent:</b> Thursday, October 3, 2024 8:39 PM<br><b style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">To:</b> RE-wrenches<br><b style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">Cc:</b> Jay<br><b style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">Subject:</b> Re: [RE-wrenches] Racking on residential rooftops</span></p></div></div><p class="MsoNormal"> </p><div><p class="MsoNormal">Hi Jim</p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"> </p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">I recommend a laser level. Can be just a line laser or can be a multi line level. </p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">Brightness is key. </p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"> </p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">Much easier, faster and accurate than using string. </p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">Also makes it much easier to keep everything straight </p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"> </p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">Jay</p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"> </p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"> </p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><br><br></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12pt">On Oct 3, 2024, at 7:44 PM, William Miller via RE-wrenches <<a href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org" target="_blank">re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>> wrote:</p></div><blockquote style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt"><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Good question, Jim.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">We should all want our installations to work good and look good. </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">A lot of this consideration is purely aesthetic. As such, it doesn’t always have to be good, it just has to look good. What I mean by that is if there are some misalignments that can’t be seen from any vantage point, then it is not so critical to spend a lot of time making those perfect. I always look to see what vantage points there are from which a given installation can be seen and focus on making the installation look good to those vantage points.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Misaligned panels are only obvious where panel corners and edges meet. Your rack may undulate but as long as the panels meet up evenly that waviness is not readily visible. I don’t spend too much time checking a roof for flat—none of them are.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Two adjacent panels bolted to the same pair of rails almost always line up. The bigger problem occurs when you have two or more sets of rails. If the vantage point is from below and the upper set of rails is even slightly higher than the lower set of rails, that protruding upper panel edge can easily be seen. If, however, the upper set of rails is slightly lower, it is less obvious.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">The key is to run a string line along the view axis to check to see of the pairs of rails are in alignment. Make the string as tight as possible. I space my string off the rail by a set amount—usually the thickness of a strut washer—and take another strut washer and slip it under the string at various locations. The reason to space the string above is to prevent the rail from subtly deflecting the string without you noticing it happening. You can also use a spare stick of rail or any long straight edge.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Lining up rows of panels is most critical if the installation can be viewed from the side. If the alignment gets bad at first without correcting it the error can quickly compound. The longer the row the worse it can get.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">We set the first panel carefully and then take a length of rail and bolt it across the other end to hold a string line. Pick a reference point, usually the eave edge of the roofing—or any other straight line the eye might automatically compare the row of panels to—and use that as a guide to set your string. If the roofing courses waver you will have a harder time making it look right. Again, space the string off of the panel edge at both ends by a slight amount that is the same as an object you have handy for gauging. I use a strut washer or the thickness of a carpenter’s pencil.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">If your row starts to deviate you can “steer” the panels gradually back into alignment. You can do this by leaving a gap between panels slightly bigger at the top or bottom to subtly correct for misalignment. The amount of extra space can’t be too much or the mid-clip won’t hold properly. You have about 1/8” to work with at any given gap. You can also subtly “stair-step” the panels up or down—in other words set a panel slightly higher or lower than the previous panel to get back on track.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">If you see an upper row is higher at one point than the lower row you can stop stacking and adjust your rail up or down on the slotted feet.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">We set the lower row first and then use disassembled mid-clips to make the spacing up and down pitch the same as across pitch.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">One other thing: If you are using wider racking like Pro-solar or Snap-n-rack: Make sure the top of the rail is parallel with the roof surface. If the rail is cocked, when you tighten the clamps the panel moves as the rail rotates to contact the panel evenly. This can throw off your alignment. You can check this by setting an extra stick of rail across the tops of your installed rail and looking for gaps.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">The process is tedious but if you check as you go and don’t let the error get too big the error can be corrected.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Jim, I hope this answers your qestion.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">William Miller</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Miller Solar</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">17395 Oak Road, Atascadero, CA 93422</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">805-438-5600</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><a href="http://www.millersolar.com/" target="_blank" style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">www.millersolar.com</a></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">CA Lic. 773985</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"> RE-wrenches [mailto:<a href="mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org" target="_blank" style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>] <b style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">On Behalf Of </b>Jim Gowdy via RE-wrenches<br><b style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">Sent:</b> Sunday, September 29, 2024 7:55 PM<br><b style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">To:</b> RE-wrenches<br><b style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">Cc:</b> Jim Gowdy<br><b style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">Subject:</b> [RE-wrenches] Racking on residential rooftops</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"> </p><div><p class="MsoNormal">Hello All,</p><div><p class="MsoNormal"> I am trying to develop a good process for solar racking installs on roofs and ground mounts. I would like to be aware of any tricks of the trade. Right now the questions I have are.......</p></div><div><ol start="1" type="1"><li class="MsoNormal"> How to find high/low spots on roofs </li><li class="MsoNormal">How to get rails to the same level in all directions</li><li class="MsoNormal">when mounting the solar panels, how to keep a straight line. So far a string line on the top and bottom is helpful. </li></ol><div><p class="MsoNormal"> </p></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span class="m_-6677537030589897208gmailsignatureprefix">-- </span></p><div><div><p class="MsoNormal">Jim with Gowdy Electric</p><div><p class="MsoNormal">Cambria, Ca 93428</p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">business 805 927 2630</p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">cell 805 975 5279</p></div></div></div></div></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12pt">_______________________________________________<br>List sponsored by Redwood Alliance<br><br>Pay optional member dues here: <a href="http://re-wrenches.org" target="_blank">http://re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>List Address: <a href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org" target="_blank">RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>Change listserver email address & settings:<br><a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org" target="_blank">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>There are two list archives for searching. 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