<div dir="ltr"><img width="0" height="0" class="mailtrack-img" alt="" style="display:flex" src="https://mailtrack.io/trace/mail/9a449b6aaaa9347d5b2aa5014f391f188281fee0.png?u=1613865"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">I definitely think this would have helped. It's a strange thing to consider... If a rail were added, would there be another failure point, like the roof attachments, which would probably be a worse scenario? It's hard to tell. There is a economic limit to how hardy we make these systems. At a certain point, any installation will fail. Who's to say a small tornado didn't pluck a system? I guess we have to consider what an acceptable loss level is. It's no different than other building products like roofing and windows. I have seen roof tiles stripped from a home and an identical adjacent home with solar panels completely undamaged. It's luck of the draw.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br></div><div class="gmail_extra">
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 10:07 AM, Glenn Burt <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:glenn.burt@glbcc.com" target="_blank">glenn.burt@glbcc.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div style="margin-bottom:45px">
<div style="font-size:10pt"><div dir="auto">I wonder if a third rail would have prevented many of these escapees.</div><div dir="auto">Not even attached to the structure, just to every module.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div id="m_-2739443137431148725LGEmailSignatureBox" dir="auto"><div dir="auto"><i>Glenn</i></div><div dir="auto"><i>Sent from my 'smart' phone so please excuse spelling and typographical errors.</i></div></div></div><div style="font-size:10pt"><span class=""><div id="m_-2739443137431148725LGEmailHeader" dir="auto"><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">------ Original message------</div><div dir="auto"><b>From: </b>Ray<u></u><u></u></div><div dir="auto"><b>Date: </b>Fri, Sep 15, 2017 9:43 AM</div><div dir="auto"><b>To: </b><a href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org" target="_blank">re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.<wbr>org</a>;</div><div dir="auto"><b>Cc: </b></div><div dir="auto"><b>Subject:</b>Re: [RE-wrenches] Hurricane damage to solar arrays</div><div dir="auto"><br></div></div>
</span><div><div class="h5"><p>What was the pressure rating for the modules that got sucked off
the racks? Also, is it possible that flying debris caused some of
the random location module failures?</p>
<p>Ray Walters</p>
<p>Remote Solar<br>
</p>
<br>
<div class="m_-2739443137431148725moz-cite-prefix">On 9/14/17 1:53 PM, Jason Szumlanski
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr"><img class="m_-2739443137431148725mailtrack-img" alt="" style="display:flex" width="0" height="0" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7">
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">More early
anecdotal data...</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">We are finding
NO anchors pulled out of roofs, regardless of roof type or
attachment type. That is clearly not the failure point. We
also see no attachment to L-foot or L-foot to rail issues. And
contrary to my expectation, we see no t-bolt failures. What's
happening? The panels themselves are flexing (bowing)
sufficiently to work their way right out of the mid-clamps.
This applies both to Unirac's older 1-inch space clamps and
newer 1/4 inch bonding mid-clamps.</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">This attached
pictured system had panels on a north roof pitched very
slightly to the south. We had northeast hurricane winds in
this area, and the way the wind went under these panels was
obviously what caused the panels themselves to fail. This is
an essentially flat roof commercial application. It was bad
luck to have the wind direction from the northeast corner (the
NW edge of the eye wall passed right over this area). But we
are seeing similar results on residential pitched hip and
gable roofs in terms of the failure mode.</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">What's
interesting is that there is no rhyme or reason to where in
the array we see damage. I have seen absolutely no
catastrophic damage on a residential roof - just one or 2
modules mostly. And the missing module can be on the lower
edge, upper edge, or right in the middle of the array. More
often than not, the t-bolt and mid-clamp assembly is still
sitting right there in the channel of the Unirac Solarmount
rail, but a module is missing. It's quite freaky.</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">And much like
tornado damage I have seen on TV, houses adjacent to each
other have very different fates. We have a new community (100+
homes slated for solar) with about two dozen homes completed,
and just one home had a panel pop out in the middle of an
array. It was gently deposited onto the adjacent panel with
absolutely no damage and the DC leads still connected to the
microinverter.</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">One issue we
are facing is that when panels fly off, something has to give
with the DC leads to microinverters. No panel leads have been
broken so far. In most cases, the MC4 connectors simple
un-snap somehow - no loss of crimped connectors. We have a few
cases of leads ripped out of the microinverter case
completely. The microinverter bracket is badly bent on many
microinverters, indicating that there was tremendous force
until something gave up. I am extremely hesitant to reuse
these microinverters because the force on the DC input leads
must have been huge. I think we are going to insist on
microinverter replacement when replacing modules in these
cases.</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Hopefully I
will have more, but not too much more to come. It looks like
we did very well here (as an industry). There are spotty
issues, but it's far from the catastrophe that kept me up for
multiple nights before and after Irma. Then again, many people
have not returned home yet.</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">
<div>Jason Szumlanski</div>
<div>Florida Solar Design Group</div>
</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Sep 13, 2017 at 6:18 PM,
Jason Szumlanski <span dir="ltr"><<u></u><a href="mailto:jason@floridasolardesigngroup.com" target="_blank">jason@<wbr>floridasolardesigngroup.com</a>><u></u></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr"><img src="cid:part3.67593BB0.3BA2F4B5@solarray.com" alt="Inline image 1" width="1" height="1">
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">I'm
based in Fort Myers and we cover the hardest hit areas
from Irma. We are in the "stuff" right now, so I'll
make this brief until I have more time, which might be
a while. We are seeing quite a bit of minor damage and
some major damage. We're getting calls from all
dealers' customers and a couple of our own clients. We
have several homes with one or two panels dislodged.
There is no rhyme or reason. Some are middle of
arrays, some on edges. Panels are ripped right off
rails, leads ripped from microinverters. Strangely, it
looks like the panel j-box connection and MC4
connectors survived better than the microinverter end
of the DC leads. Amazingly, we have several panels
that were blown onto driveways, other roofs, and pool
cages with NO DAMAGE except frame scrapes. Very weird.
We haven't seen a shattered panel yet, but it's early.</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">I'm
heading to a self-storage facility tomorrow where
there are three 25kw systems on different buildings.
Two buildings are unscathed. One building lost ALL of
the panels apparently. Tornado? Hard to say.</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">So
far (other than the 25kw I have not evaluated) we have
not seen a single fastener pulled out. All of the
failures are panel top and mid clamps at this time.
Anchor and rails remain intact. Possibly installation
errors? Possibly sheared off T-bolts? Hard to tell and
we may never fully know.</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">We
generally require 48 inch spacing between anchors into
trusses for engineered systems. The pullout values are
pretty high. It looks like the attachment points into
the roof are not going to be the failure point in the
systems in Florida, but there is a LOT of work to be
done still. It's going to be a very interesting few
months ahead!</div>
<span class="m_-2739443137431148725gmail-HOEnZb"><font color="#888888">
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
</font></span>
<div class="gmail_extra"><span class="m_-2739443137431148725gmail-HOEnZb"><u></u>
<u></u>Jason
Szumlanski<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<u></u>Florida
Solar Design Group<u></u></div>
<u></u><u></u></blockquote></div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div>
<div class="m_-2739443137431148725gmail-h5">On Tue, Sep 12, 2017 at 3:09
PM, James Rudolph <span dir="ltr"><<u></u><a href="mailto:jamesrudolph99@gmail.com" target="_blank">jamesrudolph99@gmail.com</a>><u></u></span>
wrote:<br>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<div class="m_-2739443137431148725gmail-h5">
<div dir="ltr">Aloha Everyone,
<div>I was just wondering how all the PV
arrays did during these storms?</div>
<div>Does Florida have higher pull out
values and wind designs for their PV/H20
systems?</div>
<div>Is there any thing the rest of us could
learn from all this?</div>
<div>Photos?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Mahalo Nui Loa,</div>
<div>
<div>
<u></u>
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<u></u><br>
<p></p>
<u></u><b><u></u><u></u>James
B. Rudolph<u></u><u></u></b><p></p>
<p style="margin:0in 0in 0pt;background-image:initial;background-position:initial;background-repeat:initial"><u></u><b>Hawaii
Unified</b><u></u></p>
<u></u><b><u></u><u></u>Director
of Energy<u></u><u></u></b><p></p>
<u></u><b><u></u><u></u>ES
Electrician #
10816<u></u><u></u></b><p></p>
<u></u><b><u></u><u></u>NABCEP
Certified PV
Installer #
<a href="tel:091209-155" target="_blank">091209-155</a><u></u><u></u></b><p></p>
<u></u><b><u></u><u></u>80<u></u><u></u></b><p></p>
<u></u><u></u><u></u><u></u><u></u><u></u></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<u></u></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote></div>
<span class="m_-2739443137431148725gmail-">
<br>
</span></div></div></blockquote>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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