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    <p>Not to muddy the waters, but how does the SMA system deal with
      690.12 Rapid Shutdown requirements in OG and GTB arrangements? 
      690.12 has been killing battery based projects left and right here
      in Colorado.</p>
    <p>Thanks,<br>
    </p>
    <pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">R. Ray Walters
Chief Technical Officer, RemoteSolar.com
BS Mech Engineering, 1988
Former NABCEP Certified, 2004-2016
Licensed Master ELectrician, Colorado
303 505-8760</pre>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 3/25/17 6:46 PM, Jeff Clearwater
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote cite="mid:58D70F68.7000601@villagepowerdesign.com"
      type="cite">
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      <div style="font-family: Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;"><span>Hi
          Howie,<br>
          <br>
          So Jay found this from previous posts (below).  So apparently
          the -40 series will work in Off-grid mode (as long as you
          program the SBs separately to be in OG) but won't do the
          switching of modes necessary for grid-tie backup.  I plan on a
          call to SMA tech support Monday morning to get to the bottom
          of what exactly is lost without the RS485 comm.  And to see if
          TLs are still going to work as the new SIs tech sheet shows
          they are not supported.  why I have no idea but I intend to
          find out.<br>
          <br>
          hope that helps.<br>
          <br>
          Best,<br>
          <br>
          Jeff<br>
          <br>
          <blockquote type="cite">
            <div class="">Begin forwarded message:</div>
            <br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
            <div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px;
              margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px;" class=""><span
                style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue,
                Helvetica, sans-serif; color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);"
                class=""><b class="">From: </b></span><span
                style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue,
                Helvetica, sans-serif;" class="">Drake <<a
                  moz-do-not-send="true"
                  href="mailto:drake.chamberlin@redwoodalliance.org"
                  class="">drake.chamberlin@redwoodalliance.org</a>><br
                  class="">
              </span></div>
            <div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px;
              margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px;" class=""><span
                style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue,
                Helvetica, sans-serif; color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);"
                class=""><b class="">Subject: </b></span><span
                style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue,
                Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=""><b class="">Re:
                  [RE-wrenches] SMA US 40 & AC coupling</b><br
                  class="">
              </span></div>
            <div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px;
              margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px;" class=""><span
                style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue,
                Helvetica, sans-serif; color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);"
                class=""><b class="">Date: </b></span><span
                style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue,
                Helvetica, sans-serif;" class="">March 13, 2017 at
                10:23:56 AM PDT<br class="">
              </span></div>
            <div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px;
              margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px;" class=""><span
                style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue,
                Helvetica, sans-serif; color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);"
                class=""><b class="">To: </b></span><span
                style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue,
                Helvetica, sans-serif;" class="">RE-wrenches <<a
                  moz-do-not-send="true"
                  href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org"
                  class="">re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>><br
                  class="">
              </span></div>
            <div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px;
              margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px;" class=""><span
                style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue,
                Helvetica, sans-serif; color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);"
                class=""><b class="">Reply-To: </b></span><span
                style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue,
                Helvetica, sans-serif;" class="">RE-wrenches <<a
                  moz-do-not-send="true"
                  href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org"
                  class="">re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>><br
                  class="">
              </span></div>
            <br class="">
            <span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
              font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
              font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
              auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
              none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing:
              0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display:
              inline !important;" class="">I talked with Tim at SMA
              today, and the new  Sunny Boy inverters will  provide
              taper charging with the Sunny Islands even though no RS
              485 communication is available. The Sunny Boys need to be
              programmed in the off grid mode, and the Sunny Islands
              will take care of the UL 1741 requirements.<span
                class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><br
              style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
              font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
              font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
              auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
              none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing:
              0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
            <br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
              font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
              font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
              auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
              none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing:
              0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
            <span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
              font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
              font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
              auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
              none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing:
              0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display:
              inline !important;" class="">The graph below shows the
              relation between frequency shift and % power produced by
              the Sunny Boy inverters.<span
                class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><br
              style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
              font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
              font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
              auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
              none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing:
              0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
            <img alt="Emacs!" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
              12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
              font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
              auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
              none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing:
              0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""
              apple-inline="yes"
              id="C98CA293-90AE-4981-A424-3D98EA3A5CE4"
              src="cid:part4.855BE1FF.DA33A146@solarray.com"><span
              style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
              font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
              font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
              auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
              none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing:
              0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display:
              inline !important;" class=""><span
                class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><br
              style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
              font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
              font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
              auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
              none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing:
              0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
            <br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
              font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
              font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
              auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
              none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing:
              0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
            <span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
              font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
              font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
              auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
              none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing:
              0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display:
              inline !important;" class="">Drake Chamberlin</span><br
              style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
              font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
              font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
              auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
              none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing:
              0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
            <i style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
              font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal;
              letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start;
              text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
              normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px;
              -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">Athens Electric
              LLC<br class="">
              OH License 44810<br class="">
              CO License 3773<br class="">
              NABCEP Certified Solar PV<span
                class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
              740-448-7328<br class="">
            </i><a moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="http://athens-electric.com/" style="font-family:
              Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal;
              font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal;
              letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start;
              text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
              normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px;
              -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width:
              0px;" class="">http://athens-electric.com/</a><span
              style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
              font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
              font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
              auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
              none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing:
              0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display:
              inline !important;" class=""><span
                class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><br
              style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
              font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
              font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
              auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
              none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing:
              0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
            <span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
              font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
              font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
              auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
              none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing:
              0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display:
              inline !important;" class="">At 11:36 AM 3/10/2017, you
              wrote:</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
              12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
              font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
              auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
              none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing:
              0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
            I just checked with SMA and they do not have an RS485 card
            for the -40 inverters. What this means is that you can set
            them up to be permanently in off grid mode where the SB will
            follow the frequency shift of the SI, ok for an off grid
            system. But for grid tie with backup, the SB will not
            communicate with the SI and will not change the SB to off
            grid mode. It will still work like other generic AC coupled
            systems where the frequency shift will cause the SB inverter
            to drop off line, but as far as I know no throttling back
            will happen.<br class="">
            <br class="">
            Brad<br class="">
          </blockquote>
          <br>
          <br>
          Howie Michaelson wrote:</span><br>
        <blockquote
cite="mid:CAHMeMs=eQ5g_9zZomAPwG9HZ5sZuEh1UtJMvu1AmL=YSiDEafw@mail.gmail.com"
          type="cite">
          <div dir="auto">I'm confused. Does this mean the -40 series
            are not compatible with SI off grid mode? Or they don't
            adjust output due to frequency shift? Or?
            <div dir="auto"><br>
              <div data-smartmail="gmail_signature" dir="auto">Howie<br>
                Howie Michaelson<br>
                NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer™<br>
                <br>
                Sun Catcher<br>
                Renewable Energy Systems Sales and Service<br>
                VT Solar Electric Incentive Partner<br>
                802-272-0004</div>
            </div>
          </div>
          <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
            <div class="gmail_quote">On Mar 25, 2017 7:59 PM, "Tump"
              <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:tump@swnl.net">tump@swnl.net</a>>
              wrote:<br type="attribution">
              <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
                .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                <div style="word-wrap:break-word">Jeff the bad news is
                  yer outa luck BUT they "had a work around" that was
                  discussed on the list a few weeks ago. I looked
                  quickly but didn’t see it posted. You were going to
                  install a RS 485 card/ module that had the soft ware
                  to make it work. I found this out just as these
                  “Newest latest n greatest inverters" were just coming
                  out, looked at the manual, and much to my
                  disappointment I had to send it back and educate my
                  salesperson to this. Lucky for me I was able to get
                  the TL series. Ill keep on looking, if you don’t have
                  any luck I do have a contact at SMA…. at least he was
                  there 2 weeks ago, contact me off list. Tump
                  <div>
                    <div>
                      <blockquote type="cite">
                        <div>On Mar 25, 2017, at 12:10 PM, Jeff
                          Clearwater <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                            href="mailto:jeffc@villagepowerdesign.com"
                            target="_blank">jeffc@villagepowerdesign.com</a>>
                          wrote:</div>
                        <br
                          class="m_-8682180123997891521Apple-interchange-newline">
                        <div>
                          <div
                            style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif"
                            bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
                            <div
                              style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif">All,<br>
                              <br>
                              Can anyone confirm for me that the SUNNY
                              BOY 3.0-US / 3.8-US / 5.0-US / 6.0-US /
                              7.0-US / 7.7-US series <span
                                style="font-weight:bold">is or is not</span>
                              supported by the Sunny Island in off-grid
                              AC coupling mode?  The technical paper on
                              the subject here <a
                                moz-do-not-send="true"
                                href="http://files.sma.de/dl/7910/SB-OffGrid-TI-US-en-18.pdf"
                                target="_blank">http://files.sma.de/dl/7910/<wbr>SB-OffGrid-TI-US-en-18.pdf</a>  
                              does not list them but I'm hoping it's
                              cause that paper is dated Feb '16.<br>
                              <br>
                              I sure hope they are because that paper
                              shows they discontinued support the the 
                              SUNNY BOY 3000TL-US / 3800TL-US /
                              4000TL-US / 5000TL-US / 6000TL-US /
                              7000TL-US / 7700TL-US series!  Why!??<br>
                              <br>
                              Hope you have good news for me!<br>
                              <br>
                              Best,<br>
                              <br>
                              Jeff<span
                                style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:SMAFutura,Futura,"Trebuchet
MS",Arial,sans-serif;font-size:16.8px;font-style:normal;font-variant-ligatures:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:uppercase;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);display:inline!important;float:none"></span><br>
                              <br>
                              <div
                                class="m_-8682180123997891521moz-signature">--
                                <br>
                                <span><span
                                    style="font-family:monospace">Jeff
                                    Clearwater</span><br
                                    style="font-family:monospace">
                                  <span style="font-family:monospace">
                                    Village Power Design</span><br
                                    style="font-family:monospace">
                                  <span style="font-family:monospace">
                                    Renewable Energy Design &
                                    Installation</span><br>
                                  Ecovillage Design Consultant<br
                                    style="font-family:monospace">
                                  <span style="font-family:monospace"></span><br
                                    style="font-family:monospace">
                                  <span style="font-family:monospace">Licensed
                                    Solar Contractor in CA - C-46</span><br
                                    style="font-family:monospace">
                                  <span style="font-family:monospace">
                                    <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      class="m_-8682180123997891521moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="http://www.villagepower.com/" target="_blank">www.villagepowerdesign.com</a></span><br
                                    style="font-family:monospace">
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                                    <span
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                                                               </span><span
style="font-weight:normal;font:normal normal normal 18px/normal 'Times
                                                    New
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                                                    Northernlights</span>   <b
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                                                    New Roman'"><b><i> 
                                                             Serving Mid
                                                        Coast Maine
                                                        & Northern
                                                        California</i></b></span><span
                                                    style="font:normal
                                                    normal normal
                                                    10px/normal Arial"><b><i><br>
                                                      </i></b></span><b><i> 
                                                                       
                                                           <a
                                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="tel:%28207%29%20832-7574" value="+12078327574" target="_blank">207-832-7574</a>   Cl.
                                                      <a
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href="tel:%28610%29%20517-8401" value="+16105178401" target="_blank">610-517-8401</a>                  <wbr>            </i></b></div>
                                                <div
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                                                  normal normal
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                                                  Roman'"><span
                                                    style="color:rgb(45,44,250)"><b><i> 
                                                                       
                                                                    </i></b></span><b><i>Blair
                                                      "TUMP" May</i></b></div>
                                                <p
style="font-weight:normal;margin-top:5px;margin-right:0px;margin-bottom:5px;margin-left:0px;font:normal
                                                  normal normal
                                                  12px/normal 'Times New
Roman';color:rgb(0,144,25)"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><b><i>       
                                                               ******** 
                                                        MAINE'S CHARTER
                                                        ********<br>
                                                         </i></b></span><b><i>                 
                                                       </i></b><span
                                                    style="text-decoration:underline"><b><i> 
                                                        NABCEP   
                                                        "Certified PV
                                                        Installer"</i></b></span><span
style="text-decoration:underline;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><b><i> <br>
                                                      </i></b></span><span
style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><b><i>   <br>
                                                                     
                                                        ******** 
                                                        MAINE'S CHARTER
                                                        ********<br>
                                                                  </i></b></span><span
style="text-decoration:underline"><b><i>        Trace Xantrex
                                                        "Certified"
                                                        Dealer /
                                                        Installer"</i></b></span></p>
                                                <div
style="font-weight:normal;margin-top:0px;margin-right:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;font:normal
                                                  normal normal
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Roman';min-height:15px"><br>
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</pre>
        </blockquote>
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        <br>
        <div class="moz-signature">-- <br>
          <span><span style="font-family: monospace;">Jeff Clearwater</span><br
              style="font-family: monospace;">
            <span style="font-family: monospace;">
              Village Power Design</span><br style="font-family:
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            <span style="font-family: monospace;">Licensed Solar
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