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Larry:<br>
<br>
The MidNite Solar 250A breakers used for battery bank disconnect,
and the breakers in the "Bird House" controlled roof-top mounted
disconnecting combiners, use a "shunt-trip" mechanism inside the
circuit breaker. This requires a manual reset to restore the
disconnected circuits. This can be inconvenient if the enclosure
housing the shunt-trip breaker is not easily accessible (i.e. on a
two story house with a 6:12 roof pitch. Something to consider.<br>
<br>
Regards, <br>
<br>
Gary Willett PE<br>
Icarus Engineering<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 9/24/15 7:26 PM, Starlight Solar
Power Systems wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:C905F1D4-DE22-4998-AD0D-B70F1508ABD3@starlightsolar.com"
type="cite">
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<div class="">William, Ray, </div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">I asked Midnite about using the Aux circuit for
control for ground or arc faults. They said this will (should)
be added on the next firmware update. This means if an arc fault
is detected, the Classic will shut down AND conductors leaving
the array would be de-energized by switching off the HV relay.
All automatically. A second relay could be connected to the
battery for total system shutdown. Should be easy to build a
circuit to re-energize everything after a fault.</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">Wouldn't this automatic method be better than
waiting for someone to throw a switch to shut things down? You
would have to run the low voltage control wire and perhaps put
the relays in an enclosure. A disconnect switch could be in
series for manual shutdown. What am I missing?
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">Larry </div>
<div class=""><br class="">
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src="cid:part1.08050809.02070503@IcarusSolarServices.com"
class="" height="586" width="480"></div>
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<div class="">
<div class="">On Sep 24, 2015, at 11:03 AM, Ray Walters <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:ray@solarray.com"
class=""><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:ray@solarray.com">ray@solarray.com</a></a>> wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<div class="">
<meta content="text/html; charset=windows-1252"
http-equiv="Content-Type" class="">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000" class=""> The other
option is Midnite Solar's remote controlled breakers or
combiner boxes. They make up to a 250 amp breaker, but
I found on large battery systems that we need some thing
larger. Colorado is now requiring Rapid Disconnect for
the batteries as well, which is NOT the original intent
of that article. Is the Gigavac UL listed?<br class="">
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">R.Ray Walters
CTO, Solarray, Inc
Nabcep Certified PV Installer,
Licensed Master Electrician
Solar Design Engineer
303 505-8760</pre>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 9/24/2015 10:45 AM,
Starlight Solar Power Systems wrote:<br class="">
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:87FCA53C-2D7A-4957-B7AB-EAD9812656E1@starlightsolar.com"
type="cite" class="">
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;
charset=windows-1252" class="">
William and Wrenches,
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">I have pondered situations like this one
and wonder the following: If a high voltage DC
solenoid were placed at the PV array and the coil
was controlled by an arc fault detector along with a
means of manually disconnecting, would that not work
to satisfy shut down requirements and safety
concerns? </div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">We have been using 350A, 800 volt
solenoids from Gigavac in our lithium battery system
on both the positive and negative terminals
(controlled by a CPU) to provide 100% disconnect if
case of any battery fault.
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class=""><br class="">
Larry<br class="">
</div>
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<br class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">On Sep 23, 2015, at 2:26 PM, William
Miller <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:william@millersolar.com">william@millersolar.com</a>>
wrote:</div>
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<div class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class="">Dear Fellow Wrenches</span></div>
<div class=""><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class=""> </span><br
class="webkit-block-placeholder">
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class="">Below is a design conundrum
that may resonate with some of you:</span></div>
<div class=""><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class=""> </span><br
class="webkit-block-placeholder">
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class="">We are finalizing a design for
an off-grid residential system. The
customer insist the PV should be on the
roof and pre-installed a 1-1/4” PVC
conduit from his roof to a crawl space,
in anticipation of a solar install.
This created real problems, because we
all know we can’t pull PV source or
output circuits in (or now, on) the
envelopes of habitable buildings.</span></div>
<div class=""><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class=""> </span><br
class="webkit-block-placeholder">
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class="">There was no practical way to
replace the PVC. We contrived a method
to sleeve ¾” liquid-tight through the
1-1/4” PVC to the crawl space,
continuing on with EMT. This is the
largest metallic conduit we could fit.
The distance was greater than 10 feet so
we couldn’t use EMT. Due to the conduit
size restriction, we upgraded to
Morningstar 600 volt charge controllers,
allowing us to reduce conductor size.</span></div>
<div class=""><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class=""> </span><br
class="webkit-block-placeholder">
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class="">(As a sidebar, although the
Morningstar is listed as a 600 volt
charge controller, we have found no
circumstance were we could take
advantage of that high a voltage. With
the currently available high wattage
modules, by the time we added enough in
series to get to 600 volts, we were well
beyond the wattage capabilities of the
controller. For sake of design
considerations, I suggest one regard
these units as ~300 volt charge
controllers.)</span></div>
<div class=""><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class=""> </span><br
class="webkit-block-placeholder">
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class="">We now have plans for 300 volt
PV feeders running down an interior wall
and under the house, with no roof-top
disconnecting means. It is my
understanding none are required. I am
not comfortable with this. In this
scenario, there is no safe way to
replace either of the two Morningstar
controllers. Should someone drill
through or damage the EMT in the wall or
under the floor, there would be no way
to turn off the feeder.</span></div>
<div class=""><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class=""> </span><br
class="webkit-block-placeholder">
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class="">I don’t like putting HU361RBs
on a roof. They must remain vertical
and so they stick up too high and are
hard to provide mounting for. Sola-deck
units are another option, but they
require integrating with shingles, not
practical on this job or many others. I
finally settled on a DC-Sunvolt
PV-X16A-4X-RG disconnect as a possible
solution. At $216 it is not out of
range. The unit will provide means to
turn off the feeders for service. I
will report back on my impressions of
the unit.</span></div>
<div class=""><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class=""> </span><br
class="webkit-block-placeholder">
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class="">To distill this scenario, I
don’t believe the code requires a
disconnect, but I feel morally obligated
to install one. I’d be interested in
verification of the code interpretation
and others response to similar
situations.</span></div>
<div class=""><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class=""> </span><br
class="webkit-block-placeholder">
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class="">I found no other options for
rooftop disconnecting means that would
be small, reasonably priced and not
present a high profile. If there are
products I don’t know about, I would be
most grateful to receive your input.</span></div>
<div class=""><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class=""> </span><br
class="webkit-block-placeholder">
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class="">While researching the hardware
I stumbled upon this article, linked
below. It seems to present a real
dilemma, but I am not convinced. Please
remain skeptical as you read. It
appears all of the links direct you to
the same source.</span></div>
<div class=""><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class=""> </span><br
class="webkit-block-placeholder">
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class=""><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/greatest-debacle-solar-pv-australias-rooftop-dc-isolator-lucas-sadler"
class="">https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/greatest-debacle-solar-pv-australias-rooftop-dc-isolator-lucas-sadler</a></span></div>
<div class=""><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class=""> </span><br
class="webkit-block-placeholder">
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class="">Thanks again to all of you for
helpful advice and expertise. I learned
about Sunvolt here, just one of many
great suggestions.</span></div>
<div class=""><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class=""> </span><br
class="webkit-block-placeholder">
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class="">Sincerely,</span></div>
<div class=""><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class=""> </span><br
class="webkit-block-placeholder">
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class="">William Miller</span></div>
<div class=""><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class=""> </span><br
class="webkit-block-placeholder">
</div>
<div class=""><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""
class=""> </span><br
class="webkit-block-placeholder">
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
Arial, sans-serif;" class=""><image002.jpg></span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
Arial, sans-serif;" class=""><br
class="">
Lic 773985<br class="">
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.millersolar.com/"
class="">millersolar.com</a><br
class="">
805-438-5600</span></div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br class="">
</div>
</div>
<br class="">
</div>
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