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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The hype is deafening on this. I agree in the Storedge design there appears to be no way to separate out critical loads for operation during an outage, unless the homeowner manually turns off non-critical circuits. Not ideal.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>As for the Powerwall itself(not part of the Storedge system), they say 10kwh od storage costs $3,500. Hypothetically, that might be good for 24hrs of critical load power, maybe. But not usually in Vermont(Green Mountain Power territory), where multi-day outages are not uncommon. So in my area you might need two of the Powerwalls and still need a battery-based inverter.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I haven’t read the article yet, but do have a copy. My question is what makes the Powerwall anything more than a wall-hung battery enclosure with lithium-ion batteries? Look at all the extras you need to make it work without(we hope) limitations. I am disappointed that GMP, my State’s largest utility, can paint such a rosy picture of an unproven product. The romance will quickly fade when sticker-shock of the real expense of battery –back up is exposed. It could turn into a PR nightmare for GMP.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Kirk Herander<o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>VT Solar, LLC <o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Proven PV provider since 1991<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><a href="www.vermontsolarnow.com"><span style='color:blue'>www.vermontsolarnow.com</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>dba Vermont Solar Engineering<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>NABCEP<sup>TM </sup>Inaugural Certificant<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>VT RE Incentive Program Partner<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>802.863.1202<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Rebekah Hren<br><b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, July 01, 2015 10:01 AM<br><b>To:</b> RE-wrenches<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [RE-wrenches] Solaredge Storedge<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>I hear you loud and clear Kirk. On the one hand it is pretty cool to see so much interest in battery-based systems, on the other hand the level of misinformation being spread around is frightening and time-consuming to combat.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>There is a Bill McKibbon article in the New Yorker this week where he unfortunately, loudly and clearly, repeats the Tesla marketing spiel. He reports from the CEO of Green Mountain Power - "Powell was excited by its low price: three thousand dollars, far below what analysts had predicted, and low enough that her company could immediately begin installing it for customers, especially those who wanted backup electricity in case a snow-storm disabled the grid." <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Here's a link the article:<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><a href="http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/06/29/power-to-the-people">http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/06/29/power-to-the-people</a><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>The more I re-read this the angrier I get, and honestly it would be awesome to send a group co-signed letter to the New Yorker refuting this inanity and telling Bill M to do his homework. Send me an email off-list if anyone wants to follow-up. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Rebekah Hren<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Mon, Jun 29, 2015 at 1:36 PM, Kirk Herander <<a href="mailto:kirk@vtsolar.com" target="_blank">kirk@vtsolar.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Here’s the reply I just got back from Solaredge:</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>“As this stands ATM Tesla has only announced the product, not finished developing it. As Tesla finalizes it the details will become available. Please click StorEdge on the bottom right of the web page and sign up for the announcements as they come available. Furthermore all of our inverters are compatible with this announcement “</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I get a funny vibe about all this hype / vaporware. Announced, but still in development. Kind of like the Powerwall itself. The Powerwall is supposedly sold out through 2016, with $800 mil in advance orders, and no product being shipped. Are there any Powerwalls in operation anywhere in the real world? Even in beta test?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Available tech info on both Powerwall and Storedge is basically zero. Too bad nonsense marketing like this causes some potential customers to delay their commitment to install a system.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Kirk Herander</span></b><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>VT Solar, LLC </span></b><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Proven PV provider since 1991</span></i></b><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><a href="http://www.vermontsolarnow.com" target="_blank">www.vermontsolarnow.com</a></span></b><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>dba Vermont Solar Engineering</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>NABCEP<sup>TM </sup>Inaugural Certificant</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>VT RE Incentive Program Partner</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>802.863.1202</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> RE-wrenches [mailto:<a href="mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org" target="_blank">re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b><a href="mailto:boB@midnitesolar.com" target="_blank">boB@midnitesolar.com</a><br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, June 29, 2015 2:56 PM<br><b>To:</b> RE-wrenches<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [RE-wrenches] Solaredge Storedge</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><br>I would think that Solar City would know all about this.<br><br>Or, maybe I wouldn't ?<br><br>boB<br><br><br><br>On 6/29/2015 11:06 AM, Rebekah Hren wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>I don't have any info, but the StorEdge diagram is confusing to me when it says "energy independence." I can see a simple compatibility between the Powerwall DC voltage (300 to 400VDC) and the SolarEdge operating voltage, ~350VDC, and I can also see how this setup could be used to maximize self-consumption (a grid-zero type system). <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>What is confusing is the AC output of the inverter - it is not diagrammed as a multimode system, which is what "energy independence" would indicate to me. The brochure is not showing an AC loads panel that can be isolated from the grid, or any kind of separate transfer switch - which would be necessary for a multimode system. <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>I would be curious to hear what the technical requirements will be to install the system as a multimode system, if that is indeed a possibility - which it may not be. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Rebekah<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>On Mon, Jun 29, 2015 at 8:57 AM, Kirk Herander <<a href="mailto:kirk@vtsolar.com" target="_blank">kirk@vtsolar.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt'>Hello,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt'>Anyone have detailed info on the Storedge battery-compatible system from Solaredge? I only found a brochure on their website. Apparently batteries can be added to a new or existing Solaredge inverter (the brochure says they have partnered with Tesla’s Powerwall) for backup power. They call it “DC-coupling”.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt'>Kirk Herander</span></b><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt'>VT Solar, LLC </span></b><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><i><span style='font-size:14.0pt'>Proven PV provider since 1991</span></i></b><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span style='font-size:14.0pt'><a href="http://www.vermontsolarnow.com" target="_blank">www.vermontsolarnow.com</a></span></b><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt'>dba Vermont Solar Engineering</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt'>NABCEP<sup>TM </sup>Inaugural Certificant</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt'>VT RE Incentive Program Partner</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:14.0pt'>802.863.1202</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></blockquote><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>_______________________________________________<br>List sponsored by Redwood Alliance<br><br>List Address: <a href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>Change listserver email address & settings:<br><a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org" target="_blank">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>List-Archive: <a href="http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html" target="_blank">http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html</a><br><br>List rules & etiquette:<br><a href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm" target="_blank">www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a><br><br>Check out or update participant bios:<br><a href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org" target="_blank">www.members.re-wrenches.org</a><br><br><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br clear=all><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal>-- <o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Tel: 336.266.8800<br>NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installation Professional™ 091209-85<br>NC Licensed Electrical Contractor<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></div></body></html>