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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body bgcolor=white lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'>Motor size and run schedule. I have done DC pumped hot tubs with a Dankoff circulator pump on a timer and temp sensor. You could amp clamp the AC motor and look at run time and add 25% for inverter & battery and get relatively close along with expected soaking usage run time.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'>Yes, I asked first and had a small crowd (6) watching by the time I was done and the TV sales rep was fascinated by the variation in power draw and why I was metering.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#002060'>----------------------------------------------------------------------------<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'>Dana Orzel</span></b><span style='font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><u><span style='font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'>Great Solar Works, Inc - <b>NABCEP # 051112-136<o:p></o:p></b></span></u></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'>E</span></b><span style='font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'> - dana@solarwork.com - <b>Web</b> - solarwork.com <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'>O</span></b><span style='font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'> - 970.626.5253 <b>C </b>- 208.721.7003 - No FAX Line<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><u><span style='font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'>"Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988" </span></u></b><b><u><span style='font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></u></b></p><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><b><span style='font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Webdings;color:green'>P</span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:navy'> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:green'>Please consider the environment before printing this email.</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>frenergy<br><b>Sent:</b> Friday, March 20, 2015 7:27 AM<br><b>To:</b> RE-wrenches<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [RE-wrenches] Off grid loads Load sheet<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Dana,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> Specifically, I was looking for the power consumption of a propane-fired hot tub...interesting story about heating the water with the motor's waste heat though.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> Yes, I have several watthour meters also but the idea of going into a store and (I'm sure asking first) measuring watts of various appliances is great. Why didn't I think of that?!<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> Maybe the best test would be going into some of my neighbors' houses and conducting the same test after all the other 'related' equipment is added the a system, EG satellite dish, dvd, computer for streaming, etc. and get some real world totals with the phantom load that goes with it (and to share with my customer to convince him/her to use a switched plugstrip).<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> Thanks for all the other info for other loads, very helpful.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Bill<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><img id="_x0000_i1025" src="cid:image001.jpg@01D062EF.893CE6C0"><o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>----- Original Message ----- <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:#E4E4E4'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> <a href="mailto:dana@solarwork.com" title="dana@solarwork.com">Dana</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>To:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> <a href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org" title="re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">'RE-wrenches'</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sent:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> Thursday, March 19, 2015 10:14 AM<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Subject:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> [RE-wrenches] Off grid loads Load sheet<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'>There is wide spread on the hot tubs. I have an offgrid client who bought a super-insulated (6-12” of foam) tub that heats the water with the waste heat from the (very inefficient) motor @ 120 vac. It went away when he was enlightened as to how it heated the water. I did not measure the load but it sank his battery bank.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'>I have measured a few sat systems; 32-35 watts/hour about the same as a blue ray and DVD/CD player, & Routers at 4-12 watts/hr, answer mach @ 12-15 watts/hr with cordless phone charger charging, Garage door openers from 25-80 watts/hr depends on Manu, Motion detectors at 4-12 watts/hour depends on Manu.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'>I have several watt hour meters I loan out for folks to do their “homework” on their loads before I do a design that helps & I see lots of variation on items.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'>2 years ago in LA, I went into Costco with my Brand watt hour meter and 60” flat screens were pulling 65-83 watts. I was elated to find some real efficiency and a larger screen. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'>I went in this last holiday season and ran the meter on the “NEW Smart” 60” flat screens and the lowest draw was 95+ watts and a lot were in the 125+ watt range. The new 60” flat screens come with a wireless keyboard and were full on computers with every cable and internet ready application you can imagine.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#002060'>----------------------------------------------------------------------------<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'>Dana Orzel</span></b><span style='font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><u><span style='font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'>Great Solar Works, Inc - <b>NABCEP # 051112-136<o:p></o:p></b></span></u></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'>E</span></b><span style='font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'> - <a href="mailto:dana@solarwork.com">dana@solarwork.com</a> - <b>Web</b> - solarwork.com <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'>O</span></b><span style='font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'> - 970.626.5253 <b>C </b>- 208.721.7003 - No FAX Line<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><u><span style='font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'>"Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988" <o:p></o:p></span></u></b></p><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><b><span style='font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Webdings;color:green'>P</span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:navy'> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:green'>Please consider the environment before printing this email.</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> RE-wrenches [<a href="mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org">mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>frenergy<br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2015 8:56 AM<br><b>To:</b> RE-wrenches<br><b>Subject:</b> [RE-wrenches] Load sheet<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Wrenches,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> I'm always trying to update my reference for KWhrs/day for various loads, especially as time marches on folks are of course wishing to power the latest gizmo with an off-grid system. I can't seem to find very current info. The days of going into search are certainly long gone with the advent of answering/cordless phones, satellite dishes, routers, security systems, etc...creating a heck-of-a "phantom load" 24/7.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> Specifically, this time I'm hoping some of you have first-hand numbers on KWhrs/day for a propane fired hot tub (still has brains of some kind, ignition, pump(s), satellite dish for internet/TV and I'm not counting on-demand water heater as much of a load due to its intermittent use unless others have seen otherwise. I've never taken the "kit" approach, hoping a cookie cutter sized system will fit a need, instead trying to really nail the consumption-production dance leaving room for expansion.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> If there is a favorite website anyone has for more current numbers (KWhrs/day or even just watts) on current household appliances, I would appreciate it.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Thx,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Bill Battagin<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Feather River Solar Electric<br>4291 Nelson St.<br>Taylorsville, CA 95983<br>530.284.7849 / 6544 fax<o:p></o:p></p></div><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><hr size=2 width="100%" align=center></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>_______________________________________________<br>List sponsored by Redwood Alliance<br><br>List Address: <a href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>Change listserver email address & settings:<br><a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>List-Archive: <a href="http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html">http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html</a><br><br>List rules & etiquette:<br><a href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm">www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a><br><br>Check out or update participant bios:<br><a href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org">www.members.re-wrenches.org</a><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div></body></html>