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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body bgcolor=white lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:18.0pt;font-family:"Arial Black","sans-serif";color:black'>From conversations with Quick Cable their crimper it tested to produce a “legal” crimp only with the cast copper lugs, not the thin copper lugs pictured below.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:18.0pt;font-family:"Arial Black","sans-serif";color:black'>It is probably in their catalog somewhere,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:18.0pt;font-family:"Arial Black","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:18.0pt;font-family:"Arial Black","sans-serif";color:black'>Later,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:18.0pt;font-family:"Arial Black","sans-serif";color:black'>Bob Ellison<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:18.0pt;font-family:"Arial Black","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'> re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Ray Walters<br><b>Sent:</b> Friday, May 02, 2014 1:43 AM<br><b>To:</b> RE-wrenches<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [RE-wrenches] Battery cable crimper<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Hi Glenn;<br><br>Quick Cable that provides the UL listed cables and lugs, also sells this tool for those lugs. I don't know about UL testing, etc. Is the inspector actually asking to see the tool? The Greenlee tool that makes the same type crimp is definitely good stuff. However, there is no substitute for good craftsmanship. A lot of equipment with UL listings is junk, so UL by itself is no guarantee of quality or safety. I think we can all dig around our household for more examples of inferior products sporting the UL emblem. (Consider those 39 cent AC receptacles that break plastic off around the ground opening, the first time you plug something into them, or later, allow plugs to fall half out of the receptacle, because they've lost their "spring".)<br>Like any tool, the hammer crimper can be misused. The biggest problem I've seen is folks not stripping enough insulation off the cable, and so not enough copper goes past the crimp into the lug. These failed the "pull" test. We once had to redo a whole battery bank of crimps because the previous installer had not stripped enough insulation off. See below:<br><img id="_x0000_i1025" src="cid:image001.jpg@01CF65B8.BA196CD0"><br>THHN Stiff Class B wire, and Corrosion don't help either. Believe it or not, that lug cleaned up nicely once soaked in baking soda water for 1/2 hr.<br><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><pre>R.Ray Walters<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>CTO, Solarray, Inc<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>Nabcep Certified PV Installer, <o:p></o:p></pre><pre>Licensed Master Electrician<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>Solar Design Engineer<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>303 505-8760<o:p></o:p></pre><p class=MsoNormal>On 5/1/2014 5:42 PM, Glenn Burt wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>But does it make a listed crimp? </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Are any lug manufacturers accepting it as a tool that will meet their requirements for a certifiable crimp?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I did a lot of research on cables, stranding and manufacturers methods and tools used to make crimps a few years ago (posted to list in ’09 & 10). The ones I looked at only certified their products (lugs) when used with specified tools.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> <a href="mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org">re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org</a> [<a href="mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org">mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Solar<br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, May 01, 2014 9:12 AM<br><b>To:</b> RE-wrenches<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [RE-wrenches] Battery cable crimper</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>From what I'm hearing I think may go with a hammer crimper. Being able to crimp in a box might be handy, but it sounds like the quality of the crimps produced by the hammer crimper is where it's at. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Maybe a hammer and a long handle?! <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Thanks!<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Jesse<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>RE-Power <br><br>Sent from my iPhone<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>On May 1, 2014, at 1:08 AM, Ray Walters <<a href="mailto:ray@solarray.com">ray@solarray.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Here's all the battery lug crimpers I tried over the years in order of the best to worst connections they produced:<br><bdbagfhj.jpg><br>Yes, believe it or not: the venerable Hammer crimper makes excellent connections. Its also Cheap, but its Slow, cumbersome, and can't be used in a J box.<br>The V and indent connection with the thin wall lugs makes the ideal battery and DC connections. They look just like the crimps from Outback, Trace, Midnite,etc. I've cut them open on a band saw, and the fine strands are practically fused together into an almost solid cross section of copper with no voids, but no tearing of strands at the edges either.<br>This crimper goes out on most jobs, as it fits in the bottom of the tool box.<br><fhibhicd.jpg><br>The Greenlee indentor crimper makes the same V crimp connection as the hammer crimper, but is faster, and can be used up in a j box. More expensive, and adjuster readings can't be counted on. I tighten the adjuster until I can just pull the handle down with putting some body weight into it, but not so much that I'm standing on it or straining the tool. Depending on the cable and lug combination, the setting may be 2 sizes smaller with thin wall lugs.<br>Overall, this is what we use most of the time. I found that this set in a drill vice makes a good bench crimper, when you need to do a batch of battery jumpers.<br><br><fcafcjdi.jpg><br>I used this one for many years, also a V crimper, but has different dies. Crimp quality was not as good, as the dies tore into the lug some. Also changing the dies took time, and we once lost one of the dies, and it took months to get a replacement. Not adjustable for different lug and cable combos.<br><br><bfdddceg.jpg><br>The "UL" Hex type crimper that you will find at regular electrical supply houses. Quite expensive, but I am not a fan. The dies bend slightly under pressure and so the hex crimps are not aligned with each other. The dies tear the lugs, leaving sharp edges that can tear heat shrink, and there is no adjustment available to account for different cable and lug combinations. <br>We have X flex from Cobra, MTW from Quick Cable, and some DLO from another supplier. All are UL listed 4/0 and all somewhat different in diam. and how the strands crush. I have had a connection failure with this tool, and cutting through a cross section of the lug was not as solid a crimp as the V type. I removed this tool from our shop, to avoid mistakes.<br>I'm sure with regular Class B stranded THHN, and the heavy wall, color coded lugs, that this is a good tool, but for battery connections, it does not work as well with thin wall lugs.<br>Finally, I do not recommend the heavy wall, long barrel lugs on batteries. The square lug end is just too big and thick, and can't bolt to battery terminals in some cases. We have had to grind away a corner for instance to have the heavy wall lugs land on an battery Flag terminal. <br>The heavy terminals some what negate the advantages of flex cable in the first place.<br><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><pre>R.Ray Walters<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>CTO, Solarray, Inc<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>Nabcep Certified PV Installer, <o:p></o:p></pre><pre>Licensed Master Electrician<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>Solar Design Engineer<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>303 505-8760<o:p></o:p></pre><p class=MsoNormal>On 4/30/2014 7:33 PM, Solar wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal>I'd love a battery crimper, but a little out of my price range. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I think a hand crimper will do. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Jesse<br><br>Sent from my iPhone<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>On Apr 30, 2014, at 1:42 PM, Jerry Shafer <<a href="mailto:jerrysgarage01@gmail.com">jerrysgarage01@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p>hydraulic or long handle bog difference in price <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Apr 30, 2014 8:32 AM, "Solar" <<a href="mailto:dahlsolar@gmail.com">dahlsolar@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Hello all,<br><br>I am looking for recommendations for a battery cable crimper. I'd love to get one with the dies built in, but the ones I've looked at are only for non-fine strand wire.<br><br>Suggestions?<br><br>Thanks!<br><br>Jesse<br><br><br><br><br><br><br>Sent from my iPhone<br>_______________________________________________<br>List sponsored by Home Power magazine<br><br>List Address: <a href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>Change email address & settings:<br><a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org" target="_blank">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>List-Archive: <a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org" target="_blank">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>List rules & etiquette:<br><a href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm" target="_blank">www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a><br><br>Check out participant bios:<br><a 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