<html>
<head>
<meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1"
http-equiv="Content-Type">
</head>
<body bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">I've found that instead of insulting
them, I just let them talk about it for a while. Then usually
they mention what a pain it is, and how unreliable, and then I
gently point to the various potential fire hazards, and that even
though 12 vdc can't electrocute you, it sure can start fires....<br>
I still walk away from some of them, but many I turn into full
rewires. I reuse their equipment, give ridiculous trade in credit
on their old stuff, and then once they feel like they're being
treated fair, I can install a good system for them, and make a
living at it, too.<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">R.Ray Walters
CTO, Solarray, Inc
Nabcep Certified PV Installer,
Licensed Master Electrician
Solar Design Engineer
303 505-8760</pre>
On 12/16/2013 9:14 AM, Bob-O Schultze wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:81566D0D-1FF1-44C7-B61B-8E83735F3704@electronconnection.com"
type="cite">
<div>Dan,</div>
Better he be insulted than you get blamed for the fire. I pass on
things like this too.
<div>Bob-O</div>
<div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On Dec 16, 2013, at 4:42 AM, <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:dan@foxfire-energy.com">dan@foxfire-energy.com</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<div><span style="font-family:Verdana; color:#000000;
font-size:10pt;">
<div>This is actually pretty clean compared to some DIY
systems. We have a local broadcast engineer up here
running an old 12v DR and 20 something L16. He has a
tangled mat of various wires and cables on the walls
and ceiling of his "Power Room" at least 3" thick (in
the thin spots). He recently hired us to install
1800W of PV on an out building (500' away), and planed
on moving power at 12v between the two buildings on an
old piece of broadcast coaxial cable at least 4" in
diameter. Seems I insulted him when I suggested he rip
it all out and start over.. <br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
Dan Brown<br>
Foxfire Energy Corp.<br>
Renewable Energy Systems<br>
(802)-483-2564<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.Foxfire-Energy.com/">www.Foxfire-Energy.com</a><br>
NABCEP #092907-44</div>
<div><br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote id="replyBlockquote" webmail="1"
style="border-left: 2px solid blue; margin-left: 8px;
padding-left: 8px; font-size:10pt; color:black;
font-family:verdana;">
<div id="wmQuoteWrapper">
-------- Original Message --------<br>
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Entertainment: A
contrarian approach to off<br>
grid PV<br>
From: "William Miller" <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:william@millersolar.com">william@millersolar.com</a>><br>
Date: Mon, December 16, 2013 1:02 am<br>
To: <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Allan@positiveenergysolar.com">Allan@positiveenergysolar.com</a>>,
"'RE-wrenches'"<br>
<<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>><br>
<br>
<style>
#wmQuoteWrapper /* Font Definitions */ @font-face {font-family:Calibri; panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
#wmQuoteWrapper @font-face {font-family:Tahoma; panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
#wmQuoteWrapper /* Style Definitions */ p.MsoNormal, #wmQuoteWrapper li.MsoNormal, #wmQuoteWrapper div.MsoNormal {margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0001pt; font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"; color:black;}
#wmQuoteWrapper a:link, #wmQuoteWrapper span.MsoHyperlink {mso-style-priority:99; color:blue;}
#wmQuoteWrapper a:visited, #wmQuoteWrapper span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed {mso-style-priority:99; color:blue;}
#wmQuoteWrapper span.EmailStyle17 {mso-style-type:personal-reply; font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"; color:black;}
#wmQuoteWrapper .MsoChpDefault {mso-style-type:export-only; font-size:10.0pt;}
#wmQuoteWrapper @page WordSection1 {size:8.5in 11.0in; margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in;}
#wmQuoteWrapper div.WordSection1 {page:WordSection1;}
</style>
<div class="WordSection1">
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span
style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">Allan:<o:p></o:p></span></div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span
style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span
style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">Very
interesting, but he lost me when he asked for
Bud!<o:p></o:p></span></div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span
style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span
style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">William<o:p></o:p></span></div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span
style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span
style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">PS: Also,
don’t walk into the shed carrying a rake, you
will fry yourself.<o:p></o:p></span></div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span
style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span
style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">Wm<o:p></o:p></span></div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span
style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span
style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span
style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></div>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext">
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org">re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>
[<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org">mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Allan Sindelar<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, December 15, 2013
8:04 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> RE-wrenches<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [RE-wrenches]
Entertainment: A contrarian approach to
off grid PV<o:p></o:p></span></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><o:p> </o:p></div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;">Wrenches,<br>
A "maybe customer" sent me this link to a Google
video about his Grandpa's homegrown PV system.
It takes a very different approach than the
industry has gone. Apparently it works, although
it lends itself far more to educated homebrew
than to something a company would do for a
customer. He told me his grandpa was an
electrical engineer. It's a funky homemade video
but entertaining. The first 45 seconds can be
skipped as it's about beer preference.<br>
<br>
24 golf cart batteries in a 12v system, with two
diodes per string to prevent uneven charging and
discharging;<br>
What appears to be about 2700 watts of PV, plus
two unknown wind gennies.<br>
<br>
After first viewing the video I sent back this
response:<br>
I saw the video - very nice. Your gramps has
created his own unique approach and has done a
very good job. This is the way off grid PV was
done twenty and more years ago, although few
back then had the level of knowledge and
sophistication he has. The industry has gone in
very different directions; indeed, he couldn't
do what he has done for someone else's home if
he needed it to be inspected. Unless you object,
I'd like to share the link to the video with
other installers nationally; I'd be interested
in their responses on seeing such a contrarian
approach.<br>
<br>
There was no objection to sharing in the reply,
but please treat it with respect.<br>
Enjoy!<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" target="_blank"
href="https://plus.google.com/105317412194765993553/posts/c9hE6GpXKAi"><u>https://plus.google.com/105317412194765993553/posts/c9hE6GpXKAi</u></a><br>
<br>
Allan<o:p></o:p></div>
<div>
<div class="MsoNormal"
style="font-size:12pt;margin-bottom:12.0pt">--
<o:p></o:p></div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><b>Allan
Sindelar</b><br>
<span style="font-size:10.0pt"><a
moz-do-not-send="true" target="_blank"
href="mailto:Allan@positiveenergysolar.com"><u><span
style="color:#000099">Allan@positiveenergysolar.com</span></u></a></span><br>
<span style="font-size:10.0pt">NABCEP
Certified PV Installation Professional<br>
NABCEP Certified Technical Sales
Professional<br>
New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician<br>
Founder, <b>Positive Energy, Inc.</b></span><o:p></o:p></div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt">A Certified B
Corporation</span><sup><span
style="font-size:7.5pt">TM</span></sup><span
style="font-size:10.0pt"><br>
3209 Richards Lane<br>
Santa Fe, New Mexico 87507<br>
<b>505 424-1112 office 780-2738 cell </b><br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.positiveenergysolar.com/"
target="_blank"><u>www.positiveenergysolar.com</u></a></span><o:p></o:p></div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><o:p> </o:p></div>
</div>
</div>
<hr>_______________________________________________<br>
List sponsored by Home Power magazine<br>
<br>
List Address: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a><br>
<br>
Change email address & settings:<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br>
<br>
List-Archive: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br>
<br>
List rules & etiquette:<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm">www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a><br>
<br>
Check out participant bios:<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org/">www.members.re-wrenches.org</a><br>
<br>
</div>
</blockquote>
</span></div>
_______________________________________________<br>
List sponsored by Home Power magazine<br>
<br>
List Address: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a><br>
<br>
Change email address & settings:<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br>
<br>
List-Archive:
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br>
<br>
List rules & etiquette:<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm">www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a><br>
<br>
Check out participant bios:<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org">www.members.re-wrenches.org</a><br>
<br>
</div>
<br>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
<br>
<pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
List sponsored by Home Power magazine
List Address: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>
Change email address & settings:
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a>
List-Archive: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org">http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a>
List rules & etiquette:
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm">www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a>
Check out participant bios:
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org">www.members.re-wrenches.org</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
</body>
</html>