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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">If you run them thru the formula…
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Time=.42 * C20/I…
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Time = .42 * 3280AH/170amp (Max Current)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">That’s 8.1 Hours Absorb… But you DON’T want the inverters hitting a premature absorb because that will throw the FNDC SOC meter/timers off.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Also I didn’t mention that they were only using a 5000 Watt Honda genset… so max current is almost halved in this example.. If so yes you are looking at an
incredibly long absorb time. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">This is why you have to go back and make sure that you have about 10-15% Charge rate capacity otherwise absorb times become way too long. In most cases customer
will stop the genset after just three hours of total runtime, because they don’t want to burn the fuel. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Last I checked replacing sulfated batteries ever few years is more expensive than running a genset a few more hours per month to make sure the batteries get
to a full state at least once per month. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Kirpal Khalsa<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, April 30, 2013 1:03 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> RE-wrenches<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [RE-wrenches] 24V Rolls Charging Parameters?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Steve.....15 hours of Absorb charge!? Is this just during the initial charge during commissioning? to set the Flexnet DC calibration?<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Thanks for the clarification...<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Cheers,<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Kirpal Khalsa<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Renewable Energy Systems LLC<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:.5in">
<o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:.5in">
---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>
From: <b>Steve Higgins</b> <<a href="mailto:steve@surrette.com">steve@surrette.com</a>><br>
Date: Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 12:31 PM<br>
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] 24V Rolls Charging Parameters?<br>
To: RE-wrenches <<a href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Wayne,
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Sorry about the delay!… I’ve been in wonderful sunny Nigeria dodging kidnappers and car bombs…
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">All Rolls batteries require a bit hotter voltage when charging and especially when you are using multiple parallel strings.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">With that system I would suggest if you are using the Outback Temp Compensation.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Inverter:
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Bulk/Absorb 29.2 (2.45vpc)</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Absorb Time 15 Hours. (I’ll explain why below)</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Float 26.4 (2.2vpc)</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">EQ 31.8 (2.65vpc)</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Charge Controllers:
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Bulk/Absorb 29.4-29.6.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> Normally I set the controller a bit higher than the inverter just so my charge controller don’t back off if my inverter is also charging the battery.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Absorb Time 4.5 Hours (Time=.42 * 3280 (C20 Rate) / 320amps (max current of charge controllers) =4.13… Rounded up to 4.5 Hours. This can be adjusted depending on monthly SG measurements
and or water use. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Float 26.4</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">EQ 31.8</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Flexnet DC</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">End Amps 2% of Battery bank Cap. 65 amps.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Charge Voltage 29.0</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Met Time 1-3 min.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Battery Charge Factor 90%</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> This means if you take out 100 amps it’s going to put back 110% before it determine the batts are full.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">The reason for the longer Absorb time is the Flexnet DC determines full charge by three parameters.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">1.</span><span style="font-size:7.0pt;color:#1F497D">
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Absorb Time Completion</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">2.</span><span style="font-size:7.0pt;color:#1F497D">
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">End Amps/Charged Voltage</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">3.</span><span style="font-size:7.0pt;color:#1F497D">
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Battery Charge Factor.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">IF ANY ONE OF THESE (OR Statement in the Logic) PARAMETERS ARE MET, AND THE FNDC SEE’S A 60 SECOND DISCHARGE IT WILL RESET THE SOC METER TO 98,99,100%. It’s better to set the
Absorb timer longer and force it to use the End Amps or BCF%..</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">The absolute worst way to charge a battery is by running a timer, all the inverter manufactures do it because it’s a cheap (but somewhat effective) method of charging a battery
that works as long as you set the absorb timer correctly. Plus a sulfated battery will rise in voltage too early potentially causing issues with charging.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">The best way is measuring the amount of current and shut off the charger when you hit about 2% (New battery) of the battery bank capacity.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Many people make two mistakes when setting up the flexnet dc…
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">1.</span><span style="font-size:7.0pt;color:#1F497D">
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Leaving the absorb timer set at default… this will cause the flexnet dc to think the batts are full and will reset the soc to 100% early.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">2.</span><span style="font-size:7.0pt;color:#1F497D">
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Not forcing a manual full charge prior to connecting the Flexnet DC… The Flexnet DC when first powered up will assume a full 100% state on the batteries. Many battery guys
know that when they first install them they are usually only at 60-80% SOC. This will cause incorrect measurements of SOC from day one.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Hope this helps.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="margin-left:.5in"><strong><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">Steve Higgins</span></strong><b><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""><br>
</span></b><strong><span style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">Technical Services Manager</span></strong><b><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""><br>
</span></b><span style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">M: <a href="tel:%2B1.206.790.5840" target="_blank">
+1.206.790.5840</a><br>
F: <a href="tel:%2B1.902.597.8447" target="_blank">+1.902.597.8447</a><br>
<strong><span style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:#D30000">Surrette Battery Company</span></strong><b><span style="color:red"><br>
</span></b></span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">Exclusive manufacturer of<br>
<a href="http://www.rollsbattery.com" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";color:windowtext;text-decoration:none"><o:p></o:p></span></a></span></p>
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<a href="http://www.rollsbattery.com" target="_blank"><span style="color:windowtext;text-decoration:none"><o:p> </o:p></span></a></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><a href="http://www.rollsbattery.com" target="_blank"><span style="color:windowtext;text-decoration:none"><o:p> </o:p></span></a></p>
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