<html><head></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">Phil and others,<div><br></div><div>As an update to an issue with a Fronius IG inverter and a chronic State 104 Grid Frequency error, swapping out to a Fronius IG+ solved the problem. </div><div><br></div><div>Thanks for your help,</div><div><br></div><div>Jeff</div><div><br></div><div><br><div>
<span><img height="50" width="113" id="505bf53e-4659-4d86-a9f4-9483190aafa9" apple-width="yes" apple-height="yes" src="cid:8BABAF0F-2027-4745-B907-2A6C6E15F7E2"></span><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; 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white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-variant: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-variant: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-variant: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; "><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">Jeff Wongstrom</span><div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-variant: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; ">NABCEP Certified PV Installer</div><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; ">Licensed MT Residential Electrician</div><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; ">406.291.3416</div><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; "><a href="http://www.thirstylakesolar.com">thirstylakesolar.com</a></div><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; "><br></div><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; "><br></div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></span></div></div></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span>
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<br><div><div>On Oct 8, 2012, at 10:42 AM, Philip Boutelle wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite">Jeff- <div>See if you can find a PowerSight power meter (<a href="http://www.powersight.com/">http://www.powersight.com/</a>; in PG&E territory, we can borrow them from PG&E for free). This will allow you to log and chart frequency. Present your data to Fronius, and assuming that your grid frequency is actually within permissible range, push them to send you an IG+ as a replacement. I went through 4 IGs before I got an IG+, and now no more state 104 errors. </div>
<div>Good luck,</div><div>-Phil Boutelle<br></div></blockquote><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><br></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Jeff,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Though I realize this suggestion is not fixing the source of the issue – you may want to simply widen the FQ window on the IG with the “secret code” from Fronius (44737).<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">I wonder if the frequency error happens so quickly that it is not caught by the utility or DMM monitoring.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Stephen Kane<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#1f497d" face="Calibri, sans-serif"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 15px;"><br></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><div class="moz-cite-prefix" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; ">Jeff,<br><br>The TWACs signal is a nasty beast. It is low frequency and thus very hard to filter. It seems to cause problems with a large variety of devices. <br><br>Unless someone has taken the time to check, how do they know if the other inverters aren't offline for 5 of every 15 minutes?<br><br>I think the time sync signal may be broadcast from the substation only with no reply from the individual meters. The problems I've seen have always been when the local meter is sending data; that only takes a few seconds but it takes the inverter offline for five minutes. So if you are seeing problems with the time sync signal, I'd guess that the installation must be close to the substation where the signal originates.<br><br><pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Kent Osterberg
<br></pre>On 10/9/2012 9:20 AM, Jeff Wongstrom wrote:<br></div><blockquote cite="mid:5DC687FA-E865-4A08-AD69-52447D954E71@thirstylakesolar.com" type="cite" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; ">Kent,<div><br></div><div>I just talked with Mike in the meter department. The utility does indeed use Aclara TWACs AMR. The meter reading signal can vary but is usually done at midnight or it could be set to every 8 hours, 1 hour, etc. However, a time sync signal is sent every 15 minutes. This correlates with the problem inverter going into state 104's at various times after connecting to the grid observed from 1-11 minutes. Unfortunately I was informed that the time sync signal can not be changed.</div><div><br></div><div>Mike told me that there are two or three other Fronius inverters on their system without problems, he did not know if they are IG or IG+.</div><div><br></div><div>Jeff</div><div><br></div><div><br><div><div>On Oct 8, 2012, at 7:38 PM, Kent Osterberg wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"><div class="moz-cite-prefix">Jeff,<br><br>Is there any chance the utility has recently implemented a remote meter reading system? The <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.aclaratech.com/AclaraPLS/specsheets/TWACS_UMT-R.pdf">Aclara TWACs</a> remote meter reading system communicates by putting a pulse on the line that is very near the zero crossing of the voltage waveform. Unfortunately the zero crossing is easily and often used as a reference point for frequency measurements. Devices that watch the zero crossings are often confused by the TWACS signal. The signal isn't there constantly -- only when the local kWr meter has been asked to send data.<br><pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Kent Osterberg
<br></pre></div></div></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><div><div><div><blockquote type="cite"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"><div class="moz-cite-prefix"><pre class="moz-signature" cols="72"><br></pre></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></span></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 15px; ">720.365.3994 (cell)</span>On Mon, Oct 8, 2012 at 9:34 AM, Jeff Wongstrom <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jeff.wongstrom@thirstylakesolar.com" target="_blank">jeff.wongstrom@thirstylakesolar.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><div class="gmail_quote">
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0.8ex; border-left-width: 1px; border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); border-left-style: solid; padding-left: 1ex; position: static; z-index: auto; "><div style="word-wrap:break-word">Hello wrenches,<div><br></div><div>We have a Fronius IG3000 that chronically and frequently cycles into and out of a state 104(grid frequency not within admissible range). The utility has monitored the supply and claims to have found no frequency or supply issues. Fronius sent a replacement inverter but the error persists. The tie in point was moved from the critical loads sub panel to the main distribution panel. The state 104 persists with ALL other breakers open. A Fluke DMM min/max function captures no frequency readings outside of the inverter frequency window-same with voltage readings. </div>
<div><br></div><div>Any suggestions or recommendations?</div><div><br></div><div>Thanks,</div><div><br></div><div>Jeff</div><div><br></div></div></blockquote></div></div><br></blockquote></div><br></div></body></html>