<html>
<body>
I've had success with EDTA and sulfated battery banks. In more than
one case, EDTA created a major change in the way the batteries accepted
charge. Previous to use, battery voltage would go high
immediately. After treatment, voltage would increase slowly.
<br><br>
This method has proven good for getting a dying bank through a
winter. It hasn't turned worn out batteries into a new bank.
<br><br>
At 05:16 PM 5/28/2012, you wrote:<br>
<blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">Content-Type:
multipart/alternative;<br>
<x-tab> </x-tab>
boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0038_01CD3CED.3BA35CD0"<br>
Content-Language: en-us<br><br>
If this is a fancy name for EDTA, perhaps 10 years ago I went through
virtually all of the previous 15 years of Chemical Abstracts to see if
there were ANY reference to its working. And while there were hundreds of
scholarly abstracts on lead acid chemistry, there was only 1 that
mentioned EDTA and that was a mixed review and attributed any benefit to
the ion with which EDTA was combined as a salt. Like desulfators, there
may be anecdotal hearsay, but little science. <br>
<br>
Bill Dorsett<br>
Sunwrights<br>
Manhattan, KS<br>
<br>
<b>From:</b> re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org
[<a href="mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org" eudora="autourl">
mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of
</b>Jonathan Hill<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, May 28, 2012 12:33 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> RE-wrenches<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [RE-wrenches] De-Sulphators. The last word?<br>
<br>
Try Thermoil deslphator additive. Has good reviews. We are selling
it.<br><br>
Jon Hill<br>
Sierra Solar Systems<br><br>
On May 28, 2012, at 7:17 PM, "Larry Crutcher, Starlight Solar Power
Systems"<<a href="mailto:larry@starlightsolar.com">
larry@starlightsolar.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<dl>
<dd>Dan,<br>
<dd> <br>
<dd>I'm perplexed. Where was anything mentioned about de-sulphators?
Where was anyone "slammed"? What in the world are you talking
about? Perhaps you meant to reply to someone else's thread. BTW, I do not
recommend a desulfator or pulser be installed on batteries.<br>
<dd> <br>
<dd>I'll reiterate my points:<br>
<dd>1. KC-120's from a certain production era fail and can be
warranted.<br>
<dd>2. Applying enough load will cause full current to flow from a PV
array.<br>
<dd>3. Sulfated batteries have high resistance causing a quick rise in
voltage.<br>
<dd> <br>
<dd>I welcome your response but please reply off list.<br>
<dd> <br>
<dd>Respectfully yours,<br>
<dd> <br>
<dd>Larry<br>
<dd> <br>
<dd>On May 28, 2012, at 6:42 AM,
<<a href="mailto:dan@foxfire-energy.com">dan@foxfire-energy.com</a>
>
<<a href="mailto:dan@foxfire-energy.com">dan@foxfire-energy.com</a>
> wrote:<br>
<dd> <br>
<dd>Seems I have a stalwart "Battery Specialist" in the
neighborhood still convincing folks that de sulphators are the smartest
thing since sliced bread (And slamming anyone who disagrees). In my
experience, sparklers have little to no effect on battery longevity and
in most cases add unlisted, hazardous and unnecessary wiring devices to a
potentially hazardous environment. Is tar and feathering still an
acceptable means of dispute resolution.. or am I totally missing
something? tks db<br><br>
<dd>Dan Brown<br>
<dd>Foxfire Energy Corp.<br>
<dd>Renewable Energy Systems<br>
<dd>(802)-483-2564<br>
<dd><a href="http://www.Foxfire-Energy.com/">www.Foxfire-Energy.com</a>
<br>
<dd>NABCEP #092907-44<br>
<dd> <br>
<dl>
<dd>-------- Original Message --------<br>
<dd>Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Troubleshooting Off-grid PV<br>
<dd>From: "Larry Crutcher, Starlight Solar Power Systems"<br>
<dd><<a href="mailto:larry@starlightsolar.com">
larry@starlightsolar.com</a>><br>
<dd>Date: Sun, May 27, 2012 7:37 pm<br>
<dd>To: RE-wrenches
<<a href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">
re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>><br><br>
<dd>Hi Eric,<br>
<dd> <br>
<dd>Check the dates on the KC-120 module label. If any were manufactured
between January 1999 and December 2002, they have or will fail. We have
been replacing these modules for over 8 years now. There was a defective
solder joint during manufacture. Kyocera will still replace them under
warranty even though they have no legal requirement to do so. They will
ship you remanufactured 120's and pay for return shipping. Contact
Kyocera about the procedure. <br>
<dd> <br>
<dd>If the batteries are sulfated, they will not produce the load
necessary to drive the current high. Capacity has nothing to do with it;
internal resistance does. You can test the array by pulling the voltage
down (turn on some big loads) at solar noon. This will force the
controller into bulk and reveal the maximum current the array can
produce. I think you have two problems here. With bad modules, you may
not see much.<br>
<dd> <br>
<dd>It is typical for a controller to transition to float very early in
the charge cycle if the battery is sulfated. Look for a fast rise in
voltage in the morning. This is an indicator of sulfated battery. A
healthy battery will slowly climb in voltage.<br>
<dd> <br>
<dd>Let me k now if you need more understanding about batteries, charging
and why MOST of them never see old age. It's my speciality.<br><br>
<dd>Larry Crutcher<br>
<dd>Starlight Solar Power Systems<br>
<dd>(928) 342-9103<br>
<dd> <br><br>
</dl>
<dd> <br><br>
<dd>_______________________________________________<br>
<dd>List sponsored by Home Power magazine<br><br>
<dd>List Address:
<a href="mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">
RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>
<dd>Options & settings:<br>
<dd>
<a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org">
http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a>
<br><br>
<dd>List-Archive:
<a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org">
http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br>
<br>
<dd>List rules & etiquette:<br>
<dd><a href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm">
www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a><br><br>
<dd>Check out participant bios:<br>
<dd><a href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org">
www.members.re-wrenches.org</a><br><br>
</dl>_______________________________________________<br>
List sponsored by Home Power magazine<br><br>
List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org<br><br>
Options & settings:<br>
<a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org" eudora="autourl">
http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a>
<br><br>
List-Archive:
<a href="http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org" eudora="autourl">
http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org</a><br>
<br>
List rules & etiquette:<br>
<a href="http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm" eudora="autourl">
www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm</a><br><br>
Check out participant bios:<br>
<a href="http://www.members.re-wrenches.org/" eudora="autourl">
www.members.re-wrenches.org</a></blockquote>
<x-sigsep><p></x-sigsep>
<font size=2>Drake
Chamberlin<x-tab> </x-tab>
<br>
ATHENS ELECTRIC LLC<br>
OH License
44810<x-tab> </x-tab><br>
CO license 3773<br>
NABCEP Certified PV<br>
</font></body>
</html>