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<DIV dir=ltr align=left><FONT color=#0000ff size=2 face=Arial><SPAN
class=515243817-29032010>I wholeheartedly agree with and can confirm what Bob-O
said.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><FONT color=#0000ff size=2 face=Arial><SPAN
class=515243817-29032010></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><FONT color=#0000ff size=2 face=Arial><SPAN
class=515243817-29032010>-Matt Lafferty</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><FONT color=#0000ff size=2 face=Arial></FONT><BR></DIV>
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<FONT size=2 face=Tahoma><B>From:</B> re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Bob-O
Schultze<BR><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, March 28, 2010 9:19 AM<BR><B>To:</B>
RE-wrenches<BR><B>Subject:</B> [RE-wrenches] NABCEP Exam was: PV excellent
battery charger<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>Folks,
<DIV>While none of us obviously has access to the wording of the specific
question itself, I can assure you that there are no "tricky" or non-sensical
questions on ANY of the NABCEP exams. Our Subject Matter Experts (SMEs) who come
up with the questions AND the answers aren't a bunch of nerds in a university
somewhere, they are us; working wrenches like ourselves. All the questions and
answered are submitted to a round table discussion of the SMEs to be accepted,
modified to be made clearer, or thrown out. At the same time, they are reviewed
by a professional testing expert for clarity, readability, and correct usage of
the language. Of the four answer choices, there are almost always two which are
dead wrong, one which could be arrived at if you didn't follow all the steps of
the question or didn't exactly know the material, and the correct answer. If you
think all that is easy to do, try it sometime.</DIV>
<DIV>After the test is taken, the testing expert analyses the raw data and the
SMEs review any items which seem questionable. For example, if most of the test
takers INCLUDING those who did very well on the test otherwise missed a certain
question, they take a hard look at it to see if there is ambiguity or if it can
be interpreted differently from the way it was intended. It does happen that in
spite of all the work put into developing the question, it is flawed in some
way. When that happens, the question is discarded and all the test takers in
that round get credit for it.</DIV>
<DIV>As to putting together a study guide, that's even harder. Remember that
it's a "Guide", not a book like the NEC wherein lie all the answers to the
questions. The Entry Level test is not a snap by any means, but it is basic in
nature to our field and there are no questions on it that an installer would
have to face, IE, anything to do with the NEC. The Installer Certification test
is difficult, as it should be. Unless you know our trade inside and out PLUS
have done some study in the areas which you don't do at all or very often (we
all have those), you will have difficulty in achieving a passing score. I know
many good Wrenches who missed it at least the first time. Some of those just
say, "Screw it, I don't need this shit". Others have challenged themselves to
hit the books again and brush up on the areas they found out (from taking the
test the first time) where they were weak and nailed it on the next round.
Everyone I've ever talked to, including myself, has said that they are a better
craftsperson for having taken and passed the test.</DIV>
<DIV>Bob-O</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>On Mar 27, 2010, at 8:02 PM, Darryl Thayer wrote:</DIV><BR
class=Apple-interchange-newline>
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<TR>
<TD vAlign=top>I have never seen the exam but I have been told several of
the questions are nonsense. Just like the study guide,
and from what I hear there are questions of
similar nature on the installers exam. Something is wrong with
the test generation. <BR>Darryl<BR><BR>--- On <B>Sat, 3/27/10,
Warren Lauzon <I><<A
href="mailto:windsun@wind-sun.com">windsun@wind-sun.com</A>></I></B>
wrote:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="Z-INDEX: auto; POSITION: static; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(16,16,255) 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px"><BR>From:
Warren Lauzon <<A
href="mailto:windsun@wind-sun.com">windsun@wind-sun.com</A>><BR>Subject:
Re: [RE-wrenches] PV excellent battery charger<BR>To: "RE-wrenches"
<<A
href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org</A>><BR>Date:
Saturday, March 27, 2010, 10:55 AM<BR><BR>
<DIV id=yiv759174826>
<STYLE></STYLE>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Calibri>To be honest, I don't think the question
makes any sense. There are several "right" answers, but no good ones. I
hope that is not the extent of the battery questions on that
exam.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Calibri></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV>..................................................................................................<BR>Northern
Arizona Wind & Sun - Electricity From The Sun Since 1979<BR>Solar
Discussion Forum: <A href="http://www.wind-sun.com/ForumVB/"
rel=nofollow
target=_blank>http://www.wind-sun.com/ForumVB/</A><BR>..................................................................................................</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="Z-INDEX: auto; POSITION: static; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(0,0,0) 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal">-----
Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: rgb(228,228,228) 0% 50%; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial"><B>From:</B>
<A title=drake.chamberlin@redwoodalliance.org
href="x-msg://27/mc/compose?to=drake.chamberlin@redwoodalliance.org"
rel=nofollow target=_blank
ymailto="mailto:drake.chamberlin@redwoodalliance.org">Drake
Chamberlin</A> </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal"><B>To:</B>
<A title=re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
href="x-msg://27/mc/compose?to=re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org"
rel=nofollow target=_blank
ymailto="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">RE-wrenches</A>
</DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal"><B>Sent:</B>
Saturday, March 27, 2010 9:28 AM</DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal"><B>Subject:</B>
Re: [RE-wrenches] PV excellent battery charger</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>Hi Dave, <BR><BR>At 10:44 AM 3/26/2010, you wrote:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=cite cite="" type="cite">Is the answer here (at
least the one that NABCEP intends) just that the VMP of a "12V
module" is higher than the voltage of a 12V battery? With the higher
voltage it will charge the battery with its corresponding current
based on the I-V curve. The objective reads "Explain why PV modules
make excellent battery chargers based on their I-V
characteristics</BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>This may be the answer they
want. The "Objectives" deals with the 5 key points on the IV
curve, Vmp, Imp, Voc, Isc and Pmp. >From a study of the
curve, the obvious "excellent" load is one that takes power from Pmp,
which direct battery charging doesn't do. When I draw the curve,
the Vmp of the module is above the resulting voltage on the
curve. <BR><BR>What you say about the power loss not being
released as heat in the batteries, just not produced, makes
sense to me. I've never seen any real documentation about what
happens to the power not gained in a non MPPT battery charging system.
<BR><BR>We can definitely agree that "excellent battery charger" is an
exaggeration. <BR><BR>Thanks,<BR><BR>Drake <BR><BR>
<P><FONT color=#0000ff>Drake Chamberlin<BR>Athens Electric<BR>OH
License 44810<BR>CO License 3773<BR>NABCEP </FONT><FONT color=#0000ff
size=1>TM </FONT><FONT color=#0000ff>Certified PV Installer
<BR>Office - 740-448-7328<BR>Mobile - 740-856-9648 </FONT></P>
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