<font face="arial" size="4">After swearing off brand X I did a XW system this last spring. The customer needed two AC inputs and unfortunately the GVFX topology <u>still</u> only has one. On the single occasion I called Xantrex to ask how to raise the sell (grid support) voltage the "tech support" person told me to do what I already had done and hadn't worked. When I asked for other suggestions he said he had none. The issue is still unresolved. I was unimpressed and expect far better from tech support then this. <br><br>Todd<br><br><br><br>On Sunday, September 20, 2009 5:09pm, "Drake Chamberlin" <drake.chamberlin@redwoodalliance.org> said:<br><br>
Hi Peter, <br><br>
Do you need the extra fan? The VFX has an internal fan. Are
there a lot of heavy loads that push the limits of the Outback? If
not, take out the fan or swap it for a cover with no fan. Many VFX
inverters didn't come with cover fans. I don't know if they are
standard now, or not.<br><br>
Or, have the fan go on whenever the direct grid tie inverter is being
called on to charge batteries instead of feed the grid. If loads
are not real heavy, battery charging, by back feeding the AC Out, may be
the time when the fan is needed the most. <br><br>
Before inverters started controlling generators, we used a device called
the Simple Switch, which was a voltage controlled contact. (We'd
use it with a GenWiz). I'm not sure what is out there these days.
You could use the Atkinson GSCM, generator start module, which senses the
voltage. If you need this solution, I'd call AEE. <br><br>
Thanks for the heads up on the Xantrex. I just heard another horror
story about the Xantrex 6024 system. According to the installer,
the owner shut off an AC switch and the array cooked a bank of Surrette
25CS 25 PS batteries. I don't know the new Xantrex line and don't
understand how this could happen. Is this really possible?
<br><br>
-Drake <br><br>
At 06:43 PM 9/20/2009, you wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite" class="cite" cite=""><font color="#000080" size="2">Hi
Drake (and everyone else interested in this thread),<br>
<br>
Armed with the information from my esteemed colleagues, we went ahead and
purchased a SunWise “Solar Ready-Grid Tie Battery System”, a SRB3.6 to be
exact. The heart of the system is a GVFX3648. I ordered it without the
Charge controller and purchased a SB3000 and 3150 Wdc of PV to go with
it. <br>
<br>
I also purchased a Grainger 2P2T relay with a 12 V coil in a NC
configuration (to disconnect the SB when the batteries are fully charged
in off-grid mode) and an Outback PSX-240 to transform the 240 Vac to 120
Vac (in order to interface with the GVFX3648.<br>
<br>
When we looked into hooking the relay up to the AUX-OUT of the GVFX3648,
we discovered that it was already dedicated to the fan…<br>
<br>
So it looks like we will need to put something together to sense the
battery voltage and energize the relay coil, when we exceed the
threshold. Any recommendations for a add-on HVD? And exactly what
threshold voltage should we use for 8ea 6V 305 Ah (C/24) AGM
batteries?<br>
<br>
And for Drake: I gravitated away from Xantrex because of a very
unsatisfactory experience with a XW6048. The system failed to work
properly and Xantrex “hemmed and hawed” for over six months. Bottom line:
we made six service calls, two firmware upgrades and probably two dozen
calls to largely clueless group tech supporters. Through it all, I lost
the customer’s confidence and he chose another integrator to do a follow
on commercial project. The last part of course was the worst part of the
experience.<br>
<br>
- Peter <br>
</font><font face="Times New Roman, Times"> <br>
Hi Peter,<br><br>
The Outback inverter will not regulate battery charge while AC
coupled. The SMA is the only system designed to give a regulated
charge to batteries in the AC coupled mode. The Outback auxiliary relay
can be used to drive a relay that will disconnect the input to the
inverter, to regulate battery charge when grid is down. I like an
"Ice Cube Rely" (such as Idec) to control a contactor.
The coil of the Idec uses very little power. <br><br>
Why did you gravitate toward Xantrex from Outback?<br><br>
Drake <br><br>
<br><br>
At 09:25 PM 8/4/2009, you wrote:<br><br>
</font><font color="#000080" face="Times New Roman, Times" size="2">I would
like to start a thread on AC-coupled grid tied battery backup systems. We
do a fair number of GTBBSs (four to five a year) and I have gravitated
from the Outback solution to the Xantrex XW solution. I am not happy with
the XW product and especially not happy with Xantrexs post sales
technical support. I know I have more to learn about these puppies in
general, so I am genuinely disappointed with the uneven TS from
Xantrex.<br>
<br>
</font><font color="#000080">I also had this nagging feeling that the
heart of a GTBBS should be the tried and true high voltage inverter.
Enter the SunPower positive ground requirement, and now an AC coupled
system seems the best solution.<br>
<br>
>From the white paper that Outback sent me, there was no mention of a
heavy duty relay. Doesnt the Outback inverter regulate the battery charge
control?<br>
<br>
Has anyone tried to order a SunWize Solar Ready Battery Assemblywithout
the charge controller (e.g. P/N SRB3.6). It would seem that this is a
nice package for small energy needs (13 to 26 kWh of battery
backup). <br>
</font><br>
<font color="#000080">- Peter <br>
</font>
<img src="cid:7.1.0.9.0.20090920194015.01f1e3b8@redwoodalliance.org.1" alt="[]" height="80" width="67">
<font color="#000080" size="1">Peter T. Parrish, Ph.D., President<br>
California Solar Engineering, Inc.<br>
820 Cynthia Ave., Los Angeles, CA 90065<br>
CA Lic. 854779, NABCEP Cert. 031806-26<br>
<a href="mailto:peter.parrish@calsolareng.com">
peter.parrish@calsolareng.com</a> <br>
Ph 323-258-8883, Mobile 323-839-6108, Fax
323-258-8885
<br>
</font><br>
<font color="#000080"> <br>
</font><hr>
<div align="center"><font color="#000080"></font></div>
<font face="Tahoma" size="2"><b>From:</b>
re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org [
<a href="mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org" eudora="autourl">
mailto:re-wrenches-bounces@lists.re-wrenches.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of
</b>William Miller<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, August 04, 2009 5:55 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> jryago@netscape.com; RE-wrenches<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [RE-wrenches] XW6048 parts problem<br>
</font> <br>
Jeff:<br><br>
I have a spare. They are not kept in the socket but are loose in a
bag. Send me your mailing address off list. I leave tomorrow
for a week, so I hope I see your address before I go.<br><br>
William<br><br>
<br><br>
<br>
At 04:59 PM 8/4/2009, you wrote:<br><br>
Just completed a large residential grid/gen/solar/battery system using a
XW6048 inverter.<br><br>
We are using a SunnyBoy inverter at the array and doing an AC coupled
backfeed. To do this we have installed a heavy duty relay in the
output of the SunnyBoy, and are using the aux. relay contacts on the XW
unit to close this relay when battery voltage is at high limit (during no
load power outage to prevent over-charging)<br><br>
Not sure if we lost it during installation, if it shook loose in shipment
and fell out, or was missing to begin with, but to connect to the aux.
contacts in th XW requires a very small green flat 5-pin connector which
is missing.<br><br>
I contacted multiple people at Xantrex and their service center, waded
through their web site, and finally talked to a service tech. He
advised that "he was looking for an extra one of these connectors 6
months ago and still has not received it, as these compoments are made
and assembled in China and they do not stock anything that is considered
an assembly part used in China to build their units."<br><br>
First, I did not realize these inverters were being assembled in China,
and second, who ever heard of not stocking a replacement part just
because its made in China. If that were true, 95% of everything
sold today in US would not be able to order replacement parts.<br><br>
Anybody out their know if there is a Radio Shack type supplier where I
can order a bag of these and get on with the system startup and my
life?<br><br>
Thanks,<br><br>
Jeff Yago<br><br>
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<font color="#0000ff" face="Times New Roman, Times">Drake Chamberlin<br>
Athens Electric<br>
OH License 44810<br>
CO License 3773<br>
NABCEP </font><font color="#0000ff" size="1">TM
</font><font color="#0000ff">Certified PV Installer <br>
Office - 740-448-7328<br>
Mobile - 740-856-9648 <br>
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<x-sigsep><p>
<font color="#0000ff">Drake Chamberlin<br>
Athens Electric<br>
OH License 44810<br>
CO License 3773<br>
NABCEP </font><font color="#0000ff" size="1">TM
</font><font color="#0000ff">Certified PV Installer <br>
Office - 740-448-7328<br>
Mobile - 740-856-9648 </font></p></x-sigsep></font>